any decent schools in Ho Chi Minh?
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buffalofan
- Posts: 350
- Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2010 11:08 pm
any decent schools in Ho Chi Minh?
Would appreciate any feedback from those who have recent experience in Saigon. Which schools are the best to work for? Any good IB schools? Thanks.
Not really
There arent really any good ones in Saigon, they are all 2nd tier or 3rd tier schools. If i had to pick one Id say the Australian school and British School are the best (2nd tier). ISHCMC and Renaissance are the worst (3rd tier). South, Pearl and N.America are in between.
Psguy, what information are you basing your decision upon? I definitely do not agree with your assessment. South is a much better school than the Australian school and since they are not a British curriculum the comparison is difficult at best. They had a 100% pass rate on the IBDP last year.
70% of the teachers have Masters degrees and many come to the school after being at schools like ISBangkok, ISKL, Singapore American and Shanghai American.
As far as teacher packages South has the best in HCMC. Money is spent on PD every year and it is the only not for profit school in HCMC.
I know you have heard this before but, perhaps you should check your facts before you randomly add your opinion. Stick with what you know.
70% of the teachers have Masters degrees and many come to the school after being at schools like ISBangkok, ISKL, Singapore American and Shanghai American.
As far as teacher packages South has the best in HCMC. Money is spent on PD every year and it is the only not for profit school in HCMC.
I know you have heard this before but, perhaps you should check your facts before you randomly add your opinion. Stick with what you know.
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BobbyBamboo
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:13 pm
I would say the better schools in HCMC are:
International School Ho Chi Minh City (PYP, MYP and DP) - Despite the ownership changes and issues surrounding that, it's still one of the best schools in HCMC, certainly it's the best IB school.
British International School - Best British curriculum.
Saigon South International School - Best US curriculum.
After those would come schools like the Australian International School, ACG International.
None of the schools in HCMC are truly not-for-profit
International School Ho Chi Minh City (PYP, MYP and DP) - Despite the ownership changes and issues surrounding that, it's still one of the best schools in HCMC, certainly it's the best IB school.
British International School - Best British curriculum.
Saigon South International School - Best US curriculum.
After those would come schools like the Australian International School, ACG International.
None of the schools in HCMC are truly not-for-profit
Sad Guy
You don't know, but you sure like to pretend you do.
Buffalofan, for-profits come in different guises.
1) Some for-profits are run by individual business people in forthe short haul and a quick buck and they make their money at the expense of students, parents and teachers.
2) The second set are the major companies who have seen international education as a multi-million dollar business and are quite ruthless in their mission to build schools around the world. Administrators and teachers are viewed as company resources and squeezed as hard as they dare. GEMS is one of companies. Cognita is another and they recently became owners of ISHCMC.
3) The next group plays a longer game and has a name to protect. It comprises those franchises working under the auspices of high powered independent schools who keep an eye on performance and standards. Most of these are from the UK - Dulwich, Wellington etc - but US independents are joining the .. Of course they want to make money from the operation to help subsidize the founding school, but they don't want to be seen to be ripping off their communities, because that would be bad for their global reputations. Moreover, one of their "hopes" is that students in these overseas schools will go back to the mother ship to complete their education as boarders.
4) Some ostensibly for-profit schools are in this for the sake of legacy. Someone has made a lot of money and wants to leave behind something that bears his or her name. Although making money might be a nice outcome, it isn't the real driver. It's having "my school". I know of two or three schools like this. Of course the danger is that when the founder dies, those who inherit the legacy may wish to move the school closer to group one.
5) More and more, developers are realizing that if they want to build a community of dwellings for the upper middle class, a really good way of enticing people to move there is to build a school as part of the development. That school has to be a good one, otherwise people wouldn't go. The profit for the developer comes from selling the homes, not places in the school, so although again it would be nice for the school to make some money that is not the driver.
Saigon South is in the last category, and if you are prepared to work in the for-profit arena is the place to go. I know the school and the former school head. It presently has an interim there who is a very strong educator. It's a good place, and if you can get a job there you should be fine.
Buffalofan, for-profits come in different guises.
1) Some for-profits are run by individual business people in forthe short haul and a quick buck and they make their money at the expense of students, parents and teachers.
2) The second set are the major companies who have seen international education as a multi-million dollar business and are quite ruthless in their mission to build schools around the world. Administrators and teachers are viewed as company resources and squeezed as hard as they dare. GEMS is one of companies. Cognita is another and they recently became owners of ISHCMC.
3) The next group plays a longer game and has a name to protect. It comprises those franchises working under the auspices of high powered independent schools who keep an eye on performance and standards. Most of these are from the UK - Dulwich, Wellington etc - but US independents are joining the .. Of course they want to make money from the operation to help subsidize the founding school, but they don't want to be seen to be ripping off their communities, because that would be bad for their global reputations. Moreover, one of their "hopes" is that students in these overseas schools will go back to the mother ship to complete their education as boarders.
4) Some ostensibly for-profit schools are in this for the sake of legacy. Someone has made a lot of money and wants to leave behind something that bears his or her name. Although making money might be a nice outcome, it isn't the real driver. It's having "my school". I know of two or three schools like this. Of course the danger is that when the founder dies, those who inherit the legacy may wish to move the school closer to group one.
5) More and more, developers are realizing that if they want to build a community of dwellings for the upper middle class, a really good way of enticing people to move there is to build a school as part of the development. That school has to be a good one, otherwise people wouldn't go. The profit for the developer comes from selling the homes, not places in the school, so although again it would be nice for the school to make some money that is not the driver.
Saigon South is in the last category, and if you are prepared to work in the for-profit arena is the place to go. I know the school and the former school head. It presently has an interim there who is a very strong educator. It's a good place, and if you can get a job there you should be fine.
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SocialStudies95
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:59 pm
- Location: USA
Comment
Singapore International School is right there at the bottom with Renaissance.
I dont agree entirely with the previous descriptions:
1) The idea of building a school to develop a living community is a short term one. Once the homes are sold, the school inevitably resorts to another management type. The Interim head at South is a good educator, but there are a lot of other forces and factors that are going to run the school. Its either going to change him, or hes going to move on.
2) While the idea of a legacy school is very true, iThese schools are usually non-profits, since the purpose of the school is driven by status for the owner. At some point when the founder passes, or some other life event causes transfer of the school and the school becomes driven by profit, is when the school starts degrading.
3) The status school is a notable gap in the list. This type of school is essentially the equivalent of a rare sports car, its bragging right and prestige for a wealthy individual or family to "own a school".
4) Missing from the Franchise school category are those schools that are partner or "sister/daughter" schools for highly branded universities. The understadning is that these schools have a relationship with the parent university and attending one of their "daughter" schools will ensure or increase admittance to the university.
5) While it doesnt get talked about much, because they compare so differently to true non-profits and becuase so many for profits give them a bad name, are the for-profit schools that are just trying to provide a quality product (education) to their customers, and yes make money (profit) in the process.
I dont agree entirely with the previous descriptions:
1) The idea of building a school to develop a living community is a short term one. Once the homes are sold, the school inevitably resorts to another management type. The Interim head at South is a good educator, but there are a lot of other forces and factors that are going to run the school. Its either going to change him, or hes going to move on.
2) While the idea of a legacy school is very true, iThese schools are usually non-profits, since the purpose of the school is driven by status for the owner. At some point when the founder passes, or some other life event causes transfer of the school and the school becomes driven by profit, is when the school starts degrading.
3) The status school is a notable gap in the list. This type of school is essentially the equivalent of a rare sports car, its bragging right and prestige for a wealthy individual or family to "own a school".
4) Missing from the Franchise school category are those schools that are partner or "sister/daughter" schools for highly branded universities. The understadning is that these schools have a relationship with the parent university and attending one of their "daughter" schools will ensure or increase admittance to the university.
5) While it doesnt get talked about much, because they compare so differently to true non-profits and becuase so many for profits give them a bad name, are the for-profit schools that are just trying to provide a quality product (education) to their customers, and yes make money (profit) in the process.
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calciodirigore
- Posts: 155
- Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:16 pm
- Location: Europe
In terms of reputation among the parent community:
British International School of Vietnam
Australian International School
This is really only because the two schools are right in the middle of expat area. The Australian school begins to suffer in the secondary because the campus is not in this area. The three primary campuses are and so get a large share of expat kids.
In terms of package:
Saigon South International School (although salary is taxed)
ACG and Australian International School (owned by same company - exact same package)
Probably best school (for a teacher - so, probably for students as well):
Saigon South International School
If you take a look at package, class loading, PD opportunities, and general morale, it would be the school to teach at.
ALL of the schools in this town are for profit. This doesn't mean that they don't pay well or treat their teachers like crap. It simply means that they are owned by someone or some company who in the end wants to make a profit off of their school. It's pretty simple. Sometimes you feel it, sometimes you don't.
Hope this helps.
British International School of Vietnam
Australian International School
This is really only because the two schools are right in the middle of expat area. The Australian school begins to suffer in the secondary because the campus is not in this area. The three primary campuses are and so get a large share of expat kids.
In terms of package:
Saigon South International School (although salary is taxed)
ACG and Australian International School (owned by same company - exact same package)
Probably best school (for a teacher - so, probably for students as well):
Saigon South International School
If you take a look at package, class loading, PD opportunities, and general morale, it would be the school to teach at.
ALL of the schools in this town are for profit. This doesn't mean that they don't pay well or treat their teachers like crap. It simply means that they are owned by someone or some company who in the end wants to make a profit off of their school. It's pretty simple. Sometimes you feel it, sometimes you don't.
Hope this helps.
Sad Dave J Psyguy
1) The idea of building a school to develop a living community is a short term one. Once the homes are sold, the school inevitably resorts to another management type. The Interim head at South is a good educator, but there are a lot of other forces and factors that are going to run the school. Its either going to change him, or hes going to move on.
Frankly I'd be quite worried f you did entirely agree with me. You need to understand that the majority of such houses, and this is certainly the case in South Saigon, are sold in order to lease to incoming expats. And the developers retain possession of substantial numbers to rent themselves. Thus there is a long term interest in retaining the magnet of a high quality international school.
I did smile at the last ntence when you give your imprimatur of approval to the interim head there, and then said "it's going to change him, or he's going to move on."
Two points: interim heads do move on. That's why they are called "interims". And the interim is a woman.
You know so much.
Frankly I'd be quite worried f you did entirely agree with me. You need to understand that the majority of such houses, and this is certainly the case in South Saigon, are sold in order to lease to incoming expats. And the developers retain possession of substantial numbers to rent themselves. Thus there is a long term interest in retaining the magnet of a high quality international school.
I did smile at the last ntence when you give your imprimatur of approval to the interim head there, and then said "it's going to change him, or he's going to move on."
Two points: interim heads do move on. That's why they are called "interims". And the interim is a woman.
You know so much.
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calciodirigore
- Posts: 155
- Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:16 pm
- Location: Europe
Hello.
When I arrived a few years ago it wasn't a problem at all. I was paid 100% in US Dollars so it was simply a question of doing an online international bank transfer.
Now my school has moved to a 70% USD/30% local currency pay structure. You'll lose money on the exchange rate but in the end it continues to be pretty easy.
I send money out of the country every month or so and it has never been a problem.
Cheers.
Daniel
When I arrived a few years ago it wasn't a problem at all. I was paid 100% in US Dollars so it was simply a question of doing an online international bank transfer.
Now my school has moved to a 70% USD/30% local currency pay structure. You'll lose money on the exchange rate but in the end it continues to be pretty easy.
I send money out of the country every month or so and it has never been a problem.
Cheers.
Daniel
Reply
@walter
I heard the new head wasnt interim but was actually permanent. Thanks for the update, and my apologies for the error.
The developer doesnt lease the homes. They are sold to various landlords, who lease them. Its still a short term venture, at some point very quickly the school has to support and sustain itself, which means it needs to adopt another management business style. A school cant remain and sustain itself as an "amenity".
@sevarem
It varies by school. Many have a split between USD and Dong. Some schools pay a very high percentage in Dong. Various banks dont deal with Dong and converting excessive amounts of Dong into Dollars, and locally their are limits and requirements for how much USD you can exchange.
I heard the new head wasnt interim but was actually permanent. Thanks for the update, and my apologies for the error.
The developer doesnt lease the homes. They are sold to various landlords, who lease them. Its still a short term venture, at some point very quickly the school has to support and sustain itself, which means it needs to adopt another management business style. A school cant remain and sustain itself as an "amenity".
@sevarem
It varies by school. Many have a split between USD and Dong. Some schools pay a very high percentage in Dong. Various banks dont deal with Dong and converting excessive amounts of Dong into Dollars, and locally their are limits and requirements for how much USD you can exchange.
Dave, Dave
Please read what I wrote about schools like Saigon South who are part of a developer's creation of a community:
"so although again it would be nice for the school to make some money that is not the driver. "
Why would you think that I suggested that the school is an amenity? Of course it has to cover its costs, but all that that means is that it is run properly and doesn't necessarily have to make the 10%+ bottom line that a for-profit operation would want.
Now tell me why you would think the new interim head is a man?
"so although again it would be nice for the school to make some money that is not the driver. "
Why would you think that I suggested that the school is an amenity? Of course it has to cover its costs, but all that that means is that it is run properly and doesn't necessarily have to make the 10%+ bottom line that a for-profit operation would want.
Now tell me why you would think the new interim head is a man?