I'm a Canadian teacher with a BEd and a MEd (specialization TESOL). I'm married to a Filipino chef and we have 1 son. I've been teaching in South Korea for 8 years mostly in universities. I'm not thrilled with the education system here though and we can't afford sending our son to an international school so the time has come to look for somewhere else.
I've been reading through the posts on the forums but I'd like some suggestions. We're well aware that due to my husband's nationality he may not be able to work but I never considered that because he is male he may not be able to get a dependent visa some places. If he can work that would be a great bonus!
Basically we're looking for some place where our son can get a good education (though I'm not against home schooling if the need arises). Where he can play outside with his friends. Time off to travel a bit. Ability to save a bit (I'd like to retire some day!) and safe.
Brunei was recommended to us but I've heard things aren't as good as they used to be and my husband wont be able to work. And Dubai was also suggested. My husband might be able to get into a hotel there but I'm not so sure its a great place for a kid to grow up. Any suggestions?
Can. teacher (F), Filipino spouse (M) + kid. where to go?
Reply
Whats your definition of a "good education" for your son?
Since this seems to be your motivation, I hope you have REALLY laxed standards. The ESOL field doesnt pay well globally but the gap between IT and ESOL is much narrower in S.K.
There are 2 big issues/challenges for you:
The first issue is your not qualified in IT. You have no relevant or applicable experience, none of your university ESOL experience counts (ESOL doesnt count except in VERY limited situations) and you have no appropriate grade level experience. Assuming you can apply to a provincial teaching agency in Canada (which with the change in regulations over the last several years, you may no longer be eligible for a credential). This equates to a very lite resume, and the upper tier schools that would provide a high quality education program for your son, you are not going to be marketable for. You dont have much to offer those schools, and they can hire professional ESOL support teachers with grade level experience, professional teaching qualifications and specific curriculum experience.
The second problem is why hire you, an unqualified ESOL teacher with a trailing spouse and dependent child.
Your an expensive hire for an unqualified teacher to fill an ESOL classroom at a upper tier school.
Which really leaves only bottom tier/Bilingual schools, assuming they would be interested in you, your son isnt going to get a top quality education.
Since this seems to be your motivation, I hope you have REALLY laxed standards. The ESOL field doesnt pay well globally but the gap between IT and ESOL is much narrower in S.K.
There are 2 big issues/challenges for you:
The first issue is your not qualified in IT. You have no relevant or applicable experience, none of your university ESOL experience counts (ESOL doesnt count except in VERY limited situations) and you have no appropriate grade level experience. Assuming you can apply to a provincial teaching agency in Canada (which with the change in regulations over the last several years, you may no longer be eligible for a credential). This equates to a very lite resume, and the upper tier schools that would provide a high quality education program for your son, you are not going to be marketable for. You dont have much to offer those schools, and they can hire professional ESOL support teachers with grade level experience, professional teaching qualifications and specific curriculum experience.
The second problem is why hire you, an unqualified ESOL teacher with a trailing spouse and dependent child.
Your an expensive hire for an unqualified teacher to fill an ESOL classroom at a upper tier school.
Which really leaves only bottom tier/Bilingual schools, assuming they would be interested in you, your son isnt going to get a top quality education.
Oh sorry! I should have been more clear. By good education I mean I don't want him going to school until 10pm every night doing all his studies by rote memorization all so he can take a test that will determine his future. And I want him to study in an environment where he will not be discriminated against because of his ethnicity. I don't give a damn if he goes to an upper tier school but I don't think that means that my standards are really lax.
Do you mean that my BEd (grades 4-11 focused) only counts if I have a current registered teaching license with a Canadian province?
So, after school elementary, middle and high school programs that I've been involved with at the university don't count for anything I guess if the university classes don't count.
Am I considered an unqualified ESOL teacher because my experience is in universities?
Does it look like CfBT Brunei is our best/only bet?
Do you mean that my BEd (grades 4-11 focused) only counts if I have a current registered teaching license with a Canadian province?
So, after school elementary, middle and high school programs that I've been involved with at the university don't count for anything I guess if the university classes don't count.
Am I considered an unqualified ESOL teacher because my experience is in universities?
Does it look like CfBT Brunei is our best/only bet?
I've contacted the Ontario College of Teachers but I see no reason why I wouldn't be able to get my teaching certification. Their website says you can apply from out of country.
It starts around middle school the cramming for the university exams. The government has tried to cut back on it but there hasn't been much change. But I look at the "international" schools here and the kids are mostly Korean. Are there is so little space and opportunity for kids to go out and just be kids. If we moved to the countryside there would be but then work would be an issue.
I've started hearing stories from my parent friends about how their kids are getting bullied, beat etc. and how it's all just seen as part of growing up. I can't handle that. I know there is bullying everywhere but it seems more extreme here and there is little repercussions.
It starts around middle school the cramming for the university exams. The government has tried to cut back on it but there hasn't been much change. But I look at the "international" schools here and the kids are mostly Korean. Are there is so little space and opportunity for kids to go out and just be kids. If we moved to the countryside there would be but then work would be an issue.
I've started hearing stories from my parent friends about how their kids are getting bullied, beat etc. and how it's all just seen as part of growing up. I can't handle that. I know there is bullying everywhere but it seems more extreme here and there is little repercussions.
Reply
@jessolo
By your description of the combined educational environment your describing a tier 1 school (though not an elite school). Your not competitive for a tier 1 school, especially with your family logistics.
Yes, recently your only credentialed as a teacher in Canada if your an active member of a provincial teaching agency/ministry. Your B.Ed by itself is no longer a lifetime credential in of itself. After 8 years I imagine your credential expired some time ago, and you would need to meet whatever the current requirements are to be admitted to professional practice.
Your after school instructional experience does not count.
You are unqualified because you do not possess a valid government issued professional teaching credential for your subject (ESOL) at an appropriate youth grade level.
You are a unmarketable/non-competitive teacher because you lack relevant and appropriate grade level experience in an accredited education program, post certification as the teacher of record.
University experience does not count.
By your description of the combined educational environment your describing a tier 1 school (though not an elite school). Your not competitive for a tier 1 school, especially with your family logistics.
Yes, recently your only credentialed as a teacher in Canada if your an active member of a provincial teaching agency/ministry. Your B.Ed by itself is no longer a lifetime credential in of itself. After 8 years I imagine your credential expired some time ago, and you would need to meet whatever the current requirements are to be admitted to professional practice.
Your after school instructional experience does not count.
You are unqualified because you do not possess a valid government issued professional teaching credential for your subject (ESOL) at an appropriate youth grade level.
You are a unmarketable/non-competitive teacher because you lack relevant and appropriate grade level experience in an accredited education program, post certification as the teacher of record.
University experience does not count.
"your description of the combined educational environment your describing a tier 1 school"
What combined educational environment are you talking about? You're saying at a tier 2 or tier 3 school its going to be all rote memorization for tests all day until the evening and my son is going to get bullied? Honestly, I don't care if he goes to school where I work.
What combined educational environment are you talking about? You're saying at a tier 2 or tier 3 school its going to be all rote memorization for tests all day until the evening and my son is going to get bullied? Honestly, I don't care if he goes to school where I work.
Comment
@Jessolo
You stated you wanted "By good education I mean I don't want him going to school until 10pm every night doing all his studies by rote memorization all so he can take a test that will determine his future. And I want him to study in an environment where he will not be discriminated against because of his ethnicity. I don't give a damn if he goes to an upper tier school but I don't think that means that my standards are really lax. "
2nd tier schools describe a wide range of educational environments. A strong commonality is a a majority of local students or or a majority local minority western students. What sets these schools apart is that they offer international or western curriculum, and in many aspects would be similar to a private or independent schools in a western region.
As such common characteristics as you described in your statement:
1) Many of these schools have at least some portion of the faculty who are local teachers either in a hybrid program or dual program (national and international curriculum). Given the student mix, you cant cut out the delivery methods entirely. Your son will not be educated alone based on his needs but on the general makeup of the student population. The majority of local parents will anticipate and expect their children to be taught using traditional methods.
2) You can not escape the environment that the culture dictates. If a majority of students study until late at night thats going to happen whereever you are, not because of school policy but because that is the expectations of the culture.
3) While you have far less input in how your child is instructed, you can choose not to have him take the SK college entrance examinations. You can remove him from school at such time as they are administered. In that regard however, understand that while the degree of importance varies many western and international programs have a strong emphasis on final credentialing assessments. Universities and colleges require test scores, and as such they drive a major and significant amount of education pedagogy and methodology.
DIP/AP/IGCSE/A/A* programs are all assessment driven and focused. Even returning to Canada you will find a significant amount of educational and classroom effort directed on formal assessments. If you wish to avoid them the only practical approach is to home/community school your child. Even then at some point he will need to direct his academic attention to the various admissions exams at some point. I can not recall a university/college that would accept a student based solely on a parents certification their child is academically prepared.
If discrimination is an important issue to you, then from a practical and financial position, your best option is to return to Canada. You can get your Ontario credential, and build marketable experience. Your husband could find employment and your son could enroll in a free public/municipal school, where his ethnicity is less likely to be a motivating factor in any bullying.
Understand however that bulling can be a consequence of factors outside race and ethnicity. Children can be cruel, for a variety of reasons, and their is not guarantee or warranty against bullying.
You stated you wanted "By good education I mean I don't want him going to school until 10pm every night doing all his studies by rote memorization all so he can take a test that will determine his future. And I want him to study in an environment where he will not be discriminated against because of his ethnicity. I don't give a damn if he goes to an upper tier school but I don't think that means that my standards are really lax. "
2nd tier schools describe a wide range of educational environments. A strong commonality is a a majority of local students or or a majority local minority western students. What sets these schools apart is that they offer international or western curriculum, and in many aspects would be similar to a private or independent schools in a western region.
As such common characteristics as you described in your statement:
1) Many of these schools have at least some portion of the faculty who are local teachers either in a hybrid program or dual program (national and international curriculum). Given the student mix, you cant cut out the delivery methods entirely. Your son will not be educated alone based on his needs but on the general makeup of the student population. The majority of local parents will anticipate and expect their children to be taught using traditional methods.
2) You can not escape the environment that the culture dictates. If a majority of students study until late at night thats going to happen whereever you are, not because of school policy but because that is the expectations of the culture.
3) While you have far less input in how your child is instructed, you can choose not to have him take the SK college entrance examinations. You can remove him from school at such time as they are administered. In that regard however, understand that while the degree of importance varies many western and international programs have a strong emphasis on final credentialing assessments. Universities and colleges require test scores, and as such they drive a major and significant amount of education pedagogy and methodology.
DIP/AP/IGCSE/A/A* programs are all assessment driven and focused. Even returning to Canada you will find a significant amount of educational and classroom effort directed on formal assessments. If you wish to avoid them the only practical approach is to home/community school your child. Even then at some point he will need to direct his academic attention to the various admissions exams at some point. I can not recall a university/college that would accept a student based solely on a parents certification their child is academically prepared.
If discrimination is an important issue to you, then from a practical and financial position, your best option is to return to Canada. You can get your Ontario credential, and build marketable experience. Your husband could find employment and your son could enroll in a free public/municipal school, where his ethnicity is less likely to be a motivating factor in any bullying.
Understand however that bulling can be a consequence of factors outside race and ethnicity. Children can be cruel, for a variety of reasons, and their is not guarantee or warranty against bullying.
PsyGuy, Have you taught in South Korea? I have no problem with him taking tests. My problem is with him studying only to the tests. I don't want him sitting in a classroom just memorizing the facts that are going to be on the university placement test for years. Of course different teachers/schools have different styles. I just don't want him to be part of the extreme educational culture that is found in Korea which has resulted in the country having one of (possibly the highest) student suicide rates in the world. Studying late at night is not a problem. Studying until 10pm at school and then until as late as 3 am at home and then getting up at 6am to go to school is. I'm not looking for an assessment free situation. If I was I'd do home schooling.
Bullying is everywhere. But I don't want to live in a country where my son can be thrown to the ground and kicked repeatedly (as happened to one of my friend's non-Korean children) by a group and have it written off as just part of growing up.
Bullying is everywhere. But I don't want to live in a country where my son can be thrown to the ground and kicked repeatedly (as happened to one of my friend's non-Korean children) by a group and have it written off as just part of growing up.
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eion_padraig
- Posts: 408
- Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm
Suggestions
Please don't feed or try to reason with the troll.
Secure a Canadian teaching credential, if you can, as others have suggested. Without one, you'll be confined to bottom tier, poorly run schools that typically are either national schools using an international curriculum or for profit ventures with a focus on profits over education.
Sign up for something that gives you access to a database. TIEonline, Search Associates, etc. Apply widely for jobs. Try to attend a job fair that is aimed at newer teachers. Unfortunately, as others have suggested, your ESOL won't be valued highly by the majority of international schools.
You will probably have to work your way up the international ladder. So there are likely to be downsides to the educational environment your son will be in, but outside of Korea, you're unlikely to find the specific problems you mentioned.
Please don't feed or try to reason with the troll.
Secure a Canadian teaching credential, if you can, as others have suggested. Without one, you'll be confined to bottom tier, poorly run schools that typically are either national schools using an international curriculum or for profit ventures with a focus on profits over education.
Sign up for something that gives you access to a database. TIEonline, Search Associates, etc. Apply widely for jobs. Try to attend a job fair that is aimed at newer teachers. Unfortunately, as others have suggested, your ESOL won't be valued highly by the majority of international schools.
You will probably have to work your way up the international ladder. So there are likely to be downsides to the educational environment your son will be in, but outside of Korea, you're unlikely to find the specific problems you mentioned.
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LafferCurve
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 3:09 pm
"Getting a valid teaching certificate is a non issue"
Well then you should definitely get it ASAP, it makes a huge difference. I have various teaching experience (including as a licensed math teacher) but no current license, and it was very hard to find decent work, even as a single male.
Get a license that would allow you to teach in Canada. That's the first step. Then apply to every job that fits your specs, using all the specialized search engines. Don't just apply to dream jobs, apply to dream jobs but also safety jobs. If you ask me, there's a good chance you'll find something reasonable, though I suppose my definition of "reasonable" might be colored by the fact that I'm young, single, unattached, without children. I'm sure your needs in terms of salary/health insurance/etc. are much higher. Since you have experience in Asia, maybe you should ask around about other Asian countries? Philippines, Taiwan, etc. I don't know what the educational environment is like there.
Well then you should definitely get it ASAP, it makes a huge difference. I have various teaching experience (including as a licensed math teacher) but no current license, and it was very hard to find decent work, even as a single male.
Get a license that would allow you to teach in Canada. That's the first step. Then apply to every job that fits your specs, using all the specialized search engines. Don't just apply to dream jobs, apply to dream jobs but also safety jobs. If you ask me, there's a good chance you'll find something reasonable, though I suppose my definition of "reasonable" might be colored by the fact that I'm young, single, unattached, without children. I'm sure your needs in terms of salary/health insurance/etc. are much higher. Since you have experience in Asia, maybe you should ask around about other Asian countries? Philippines, Taiwan, etc. I don't know what the educational environment is like there.
Unlike the USA which likes collecting registration money for a 'license' many countries require you to be an active teacher there to be licensed. If you did your degree there, lived there etc, the board will give you a letter explaining their position. That's legally enough to by pass the requirement for active certification, and practically enough if you've been doing your PD.
Having said that, I feel PD at my last school made me stupider and more cynical....so maybe more PD is not a good thing....
Having said that, I feel PD at my last school made me stupider and more cynical....so maybe more PD is not a good thing....
Have you considered staying in Korea? There are a number of International Schools here that you could work and your son could attend. I assume that your husband is currently employed, so he would be able to continue. My school has a number of single parents or one parent-is-a-teacher families.
If you want to work somewhere with other foreign kids, I'd suggest Dwight or SFS. There's a school down in Busan as well.
A lot of International schools have opened up in the last couple of years- it's entirely possible to get hired at one of them, spend a couple of years here in an International environment, then move somewhere else for you son to grow up.
If you want to work somewhere with other foreign kids, I'd suggest Dwight or SFS. There's a school down in Busan as well.
A lot of International schools have opened up in the last couple of years- it's entirely possible to get hired at one of them, spend a couple of years here in an International environment, then move somewhere else for you son to grow up.