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Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Postby majorreaction » Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:32 am

Hey everyone,

So for the last 3 years, it has been my goal to become an international teacher. I have fortunately had the privilege of traveling and Germany is one of the places through my travels I have fallen in love with (particularly Munich and Frankfurt). It is my goal to move there and teach. I am currently a junior at UCF and am in a Secondary Education, English Language Arts program.

As I'm still only a junior, I'm wondering what I can do to make myself seem more competitive while I'm still in school and what else I can do while doing my 2 years of teaching here in the states. Should I take online workshops on IB/AP stuff? (still only have a vague idea on what that is). Should I add certifications? Should I spend my summers getting "higher-quality" experience by being a paid teaching assistant at a camp/program in the US? Are there any other things that I should do?

Though I'd prefer to start teaching abroad right after I graduate college, I realize that in order to be competitive I will most likely need to gain two years of experience here in the states. I'm not sure exactly how competitive it is to get into some of the better international schools in Germany as it is to get into some of the better schools in other countries but I would prefer for it to be an international school in Munich, Frankfurt, or Hamburg.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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Re: Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Postby Thames Pirate » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:00 pm

Your options are myriad. I would say that if you plan on spending years in domestic teaching, you will end up with that, but if you PLAN on going abroad right away, you can.

Do you speak German? If you are at a B2 or so, you can probably come and teach in a public school. Germany has a serious teacher shortage, and if you wanted to do your Ref here, you could probably do that and end up with a German teaching license. Something to consider at least.

Otherwise (and definitely required with a German cert)--get a second endorsement. Then start looking at schools. You will want to move away from big agencies for this; look instead for smaller schools, often boarding schools--schools like Louisenlund or Schloss Salem. Or even an English language Gymnasium.

Lots of options out there, but they require a bit of leg work to find.
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Re: Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Postby majorreaction » Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:24 pm

Thames Pirate wrote:
> Your options are myriad. I would say that if you plan on spending years in
> domestic teaching, you will end up with that, but if you PLAN on going
> abroad right away, you can.
>
> Do you speak German? If you are at a B2 or so, you can probably come and
> teach in a public school. Germany has a serious teacher shortage, and if
> you wanted to do your Ref here, you could probably do that and end up with
> a German teaching license. Something to consider at least.
>
> Otherwise (and definitely required with a German cert)--get a second
> endorsement. Then start looking at schools. You will want to move away
> from big agencies for this; look instead for smaller schools, often
> boarding schools--schools like Louisenlund or Schloss Salem. Or even an
> English language Gymnasium.
>
> Lots of options out there, but they require a bit of leg work to find.
Thanks so much for your informative post! I do not currently speak German, no, but it is something I have strongly considered picking up. The route you suggested is definitely one for me to consider.

Now say I were to decide to do my 2 years post-graduate here in the states instead. Would that experience alone make me competitive enough for something like a tier 2 IS in Germany? Or is there something else I would need to do such as get my masters or a specific endorsement (not sure which one) like you suggested that I should add.

I know in some countries such as Asia that 2 years of experience may make me competitive enough for a high tier 3 or tier 2 school. I wasn't sure if that was the case with Germany. I have looked at all of the German IS schools reviewed here on the site and would not be opposed to starting at any of them if thats what I had to do in order to get to a school like Munich IS for instance.
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Re: Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Postby Thames Pirate » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:53 am

The answer is, as with everything, it depends.

What kind of experience? AP/IB? Range of subjects and grade levels? Startup school? On any teams or hold any other positions? How are your recs? What about your portfolio or examples you can discuss? These are things that will influence your chances. So will your ability to write a resume and sell yourself.

People get good jobs with limited or no experience, and people with lots of good experience don't get jobs. There is no hard and fast rule.

But you should definitely get a second endorsement, even if you don't teach the second subject.

Munich is definitely a reach, and that's coming from the positive thinking person here on the forum. You should still apply to the good schools, though many of them are a stretch without or with limited experience, sure. Anything can happen. But really most of the schools discussed here are going to be tough. You will need great experiences and recs as well as some luck for most.

Again, if you are set on Germany, look off the beaten track and beyond the schools on this forum--at schools like the ones I mentioned or similar. There are a lot of smaller international schools or schools in smaller cities--Kaemmer Bilingual, Kings College Frankfurt or, if you are religious, Black Forest Academy are good examples.
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Response

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:30 am

I would start by seeing if you can do your senior year abroad in Germany possibly your field experience.
You need classroom experience, there is no substitute, if you can and your uni allows it see if you can extend your field work to a whole year internship (with you as TOR) so that you can use that experience on your resume. If your Uni has one also look to see if they offer a year bachelors/masters in edu, and then during that 5th year see if you can extend your internship a second year as an independent study or something. This would allow you to get two years of experience in hopefully a better quality DS.

AP/IB workshops arent going to mean very much, if you can get a DS to pay for them great, its a busy weekend, but I wouldnt put coin into it. These workshops are intended to qualify DTs/ITs to teach the workshop seminar subject in their DS/IS.

What credentials would you add? Humanities (social studies) is a nice compliment to literature at lower secondary ISs.

Teaching Assistant (TA) experience isnt worth anything in IE. Camp counselor isnt worth anything.

You need to start studying German now, with a strong enough German fluency that opens opportunities for you in German DSs. B2 takes some major study though.

Lots of ITs want to go to the EU and Germany especially those cities are pretty popular. With zero experience and wanting an upper tier IS and being a literature IT its probably not likely unless you have some angle.

I agree with @Thames Pirate that those options are out there, and its why I recommended the study abroad option, as that will get you in Germany, and you can interview for these vacancies as they are typically only advertised locally.

The consensus of the forums major contributors is two years post credentialing to enter IE. The problem you will have is going to be how your field experience goes if you do it in the states, because there are a lot of literature DTs, and your going to need a DS to hire you right out of Uni with a job to get that experience. If you dont have an "in" to getting hired, you could be waiting years to get that experience.

No, two years post credentialing is not enough to get into a tier 2 IS in Germany. That will barely get you into an agency or an IS at all. Third tier, and likely in Asia not even in Europe, much less Germany.
A Masters isnt going to be a golden ticket either, you need experience, not 2 years but 6 years. You need to teach literature, and that means SLL level, and have a record of good results at SLL. IB experience wouldnt hurt at all, but youre going to need to get into an IB DS/IS and then get them to give you a DIP course load.
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Re: Response

Postby Heliotrope » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:17 am

PsyGuy wrote:
> The consensus of the forums major contributors is two years post credentialing to enter IE.

No, there is only a consensus that you need two years teaching experience post-credentialing to get considered by a decent IS.
Those two years can be done at either a DS or a less-than-great tier 3 IS.
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Reply

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:19 am

@Heliotrope

No, The consensus of the forums major contributors recommends two years post credentialing experience in K12/KS to enter IE.
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Re: Reply

Postby Heliotrope » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:26 am

I'm not sure what makes you think the consensus is what you say it is. @Thames Pirate and myself have disagreed already, and so far you're the only one saying you need domestic experience to enter IE.
I know many that went into IE straight after graduating.

You can only argue that the domestic route might give the teacher more support during those first two years, as the domestic system is more set up to train new teachers, but to enter IE you only need your certification, and not even that is a strict requirement as you just pointed out in another topic.
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Reply

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:30 am

@Heliotrope

Im pretty sure, I can argue whatever position I want. IE is not resourced to mentor an intern class IT, its not the place for an IT to make their bones. Though on occasion under certain limiting conditions I have recommended an IT enter IE before obtaining the recommended two years post credentialing experience, as the recommended pathway wasnt likely to be viable. None of these are requirements, they are recommendations.

The consensus of the forums major contributors recommends two years post credentialing experience in K12/KS to enter IE.
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Re: Reply

Postby Heliotrope » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:37 am

Yes, you can argue what you want. I should have said that you can only argue that if you want anyone to take you seriously.

And you still haven't said what makes you think that that is the consensus. I've read just about all posts on this forum, and I don't see it. We disagree.

If someone really wants to go international, I'd recommend they go international as soon as they can, which is after getting credentialed. There's no problem landing a job without domestic experience.
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Reply

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:45 am

@Heliotrope

Were you recently appointed to represent some contingent or group of ITs? If not than when you state "if you want anyone to take you seriously", youre really just referencing yourself, in which case... meh.

I have read all post on this forum, and have written about a fifth of all of them.

Well there are problems with that and thus why the recommendation of the major forum contributors is two years post credentialing experience in a K12/KS environment prior to entry into IE.
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Re: Reply

Postby Heliotrope » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:50 am

PsyGuy wrote:
> I have read all post on this forum, and have written about a fifth of all
> of them.

Your mother must be so proud.
Still, there wasn't a consensus.


> Well there are problems with that and thus why the recommendation of the
> major forum contributors is two years post credentialing experience in a
> K12/KS environment prior to entry into IE.

Nope, no problems getting a job without two years of domestic experience.
I can guarantee any certified teacher can land a job in IE if they're ok in the bottom tier 3 and don't mind Chinese food too much.
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Reply

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:03 am

@Heliotrope

Yes there is. The consensus recommendation of the major forum contributors is two years post credentialing experience in a K12/KS environment prior to entry into IE.

I have often wrote that there is a job for anyone if you will accept anything but getting an appointment does not mean there are not difficulties and challenges with that appointment that would be cause for not recommending it, but we disagree.
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Re: Planning ahead. How can I become an IT in Germany?

Postby shadylane » Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:05 am

Thames Pirate wrote:

You will want to move away
> from big agencies for this; look instead for smaller schools, often
> boarding schools--schools like Louisenlund or Schloss Salem.

Are you sure about Salem ? I'd heard that it was extremely competitive. Maybe next the OP should apply to Eton College in the UK or Exeter Academy in the US if they fancy a jaunt in one of those countries ?
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Re: Response

Postby majorreaction » Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:21 am

@PsyGuy

Thank you so much for your very informative post. It is all things I will heavily consider and I have begun to study German.

What are your thoughts on DoDEA? When talking with my university/advisor this was a pathway that was brought up to me. Apparently my school has a relationship with DoDEA and I could potentially have the opportunity to do my student teaching abroad with them. Having student taught through DoDEA gives you priority I guess when applying to them and you could even get hired on at the end of your student teaching.

Im not sure if my chances would be very good though when it comes to getting placed in Germany at first. It sounds like it is random but that you have the opportunity to transfer out to a different school. I would be willing to start somewhere else at first if that was the case.

If I could get my foot in the door through them and gain the required experience (4-6 years?) maybe then I would have a better shot with a Munich IS or another quality IS in Germany? Not sure if DoDEA or that route is even realistic for me but it was something that was suggested.
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