Current Employer References
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Current Employer References
I just had an interview and the employer requested references from my current employer, in particular my principal. I'm not sure how to approach the situation since I haven't told anyone in my school that I'm applying elsewhere. I'm not sure how my principal would take the news and if it would hurt my standing by telling her I am looking elsewhere. I am working in the US and the opportunity abroad is a great one - but I'm unsure what to do in the situation.
Response
We get this inquiry a lot, and it puts you in the middle of a conundrum, because the main issue is that you dont know how serious the IS recruiter/leadership is in you. You might be there top pick, but you might be just another candidate who made it past the first interview and your not really on the short, short list yet.
The best solution (not an ideal one just the best) is that you have to talk to the IS, mainly the recruiter or leadership and explain the situation to them. Your going to get somewhere near one of two pathways, either 1) They are really interested in you and they understand the situation they are putting you in and are willing to move forward. The forward outcome you want to be at is the IS is offering/offers you a contract contingent on references. This is the best your going to hope for, because you dont know how your principal is going to respond. Its entirely possible they sabotage you so they dont lose you, or for some other reason.
2) They act indifferent or hostile to your scenario. They tell you its the standard policy, or something and they wont move forward without a reference. At that point your risk factor goes up. They arent likely to tell you where you are in the candidate pool, and your going to have to have that conversation with your principal if you want that reference and you have a considerable risk that the conversation jeopardizes your current appointment. You could easily not get the IS offer, and find yourself non-renewed at your DS.
Without more its difficult to provide more refined advice. The rule is when an IS wants you they really want you, so if they can follow pathway 1 and they work with you thats the best, if their approach is pathway 2, it depends what your relationship is with your current leadership, I wouldnt risk it.
The best solution (not an ideal one just the best) is that you have to talk to the IS, mainly the recruiter or leadership and explain the situation to them. Your going to get somewhere near one of two pathways, either 1) They are really interested in you and they understand the situation they are putting you in and are willing to move forward. The forward outcome you want to be at is the IS is offering/offers you a contract contingent on references. This is the best your going to hope for, because you dont know how your principal is going to respond. Its entirely possible they sabotage you so they dont lose you, or for some other reason.
2) They act indifferent or hostile to your scenario. They tell you its the standard policy, or something and they wont move forward without a reference. At that point your risk factor goes up. They arent likely to tell you where you are in the candidate pool, and your going to have to have that conversation with your principal if you want that reference and you have a considerable risk that the conversation jeopardizes your current appointment. You could easily not get the IS offer, and find yourself non-renewed at your DS.
Without more its difficult to provide more refined advice. The rule is when an IS wants you they really want you, so if they can follow pathway 1 and they work with you thats the best, if their approach is pathway 2, it depends what your relationship is with your current leadership, I wouldnt risk it.
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Re: Current Employer References
Yikes! I have received a lot of feedback regarding this situation and it's such a sticky one. I did give the recruiter several references but he seems to be inclined to speak with principals - which is odd because my principal has very limited interaction with me, is barely around, and can be hard to read. I have done really well during observations and am well liked by my colleagues, peers and students - and I don't think she would enjoy the fact that I am considering leaving. There have been several teachers who have left in recent years. As you said, I don't want to jeopardize my good standing by requesting a reference. The interviewer said very favorable things and gave me many inclinations that things will move forward - but you never know and I don't want to do harm to my position or have my principal give a less than spectacular reference because she wants to keep me.
Reply
@business88
This is common, leadership being leadership really only values the thoughts of other leadership, and that means the HOS whatever title they go by.
This is a common concern that in very large DSs an IT might not have much of a relationship or interaction with their Principal or HOS, but the locust of it is this, if there are any problems with a DT/IT the HOS is going to know, and they might be the only one who knows. Thats what recruiters and leadership want to know.
This is what you need to do, approach the IS, and tell the recruiter you arent comfortable with providing a reference from your principal, but you would be when they are able to make you an offer. Again, as above, if they blow you off then move on, you werent really at the top of their list. If they accept this then you need to advise them of the scenario with your current position and relationship with your principal. If they still want to move forward, great, when the time comes have a brief and frank discussion with your principal.
My POV is that it is not to your benefit to take such a lofty risk solely on a speculative vacancy that is still at interview stage.
This is common, leadership being leadership really only values the thoughts of other leadership, and that means the HOS whatever title they go by.
This is a common concern that in very large DSs an IT might not have much of a relationship or interaction with their Principal or HOS, but the locust of it is this, if there are any problems with a DT/IT the HOS is going to know, and they might be the only one who knows. Thats what recruiters and leadership want to know.
This is what you need to do, approach the IS, and tell the recruiter you arent comfortable with providing a reference from your principal, but you would be when they are able to make you an offer. Again, as above, if they blow you off then move on, you werent really at the top of their list. If they accept this then you need to advise them of the scenario with your current position and relationship with your principal. If they still want to move forward, great, when the time comes have a brief and frank discussion with your principal.
My POV is that it is not to your benefit to take such a lofty risk solely on a speculative vacancy that is still at interview stage.
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Re: Current Employer References
Thank you, PsyGuy!
It is quite a difficult dilemma and your insight and knowledge have been helpful.
It is quite a difficult dilemma and your insight and knowledge have been helpful.
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Dredge
- Posts: 123
- Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:25 pm
- Location: Three continents, mentally and physically
Re: Current Employer References
Are you in a public school in the US? If you are, I would assume you have nothing to worry about. Usually, in US public schools you have to sign a letter of intent in say, April, before you sign your contract in June for the following school year. To me, as an Admin, if you cannot provide the reference we are asking for then 1) you are hiding something or 2) you are not seriously considering the job.
If you have some complicated story as to why you can't or prefer not to supply a specific reference, it then appears overly dramatic, which is a red flag.
I hope you make the choice that is best for you.
If you have some complicated story as to why you can't or prefer not to supply a specific reference, it then appears overly dramatic, which is a red flag.
I hope you make the choice that is best for you.
Re: Current Employer References
I completely agree with Dredge. If you are in a public school in the US, and probably even if you are in a private school, you have nothing to worry about. For one thing, you are not leaving your school to go to another school in the district, which might indicate that you are unhappy with your school or your admin. You are possibly leaving your school to go abroad! There is no insult and anyone worth their salt would be supportive of you doing that.
The first time I went abroad I had just gotten hired on by a school in my dream district. Before I took the job abroad, I explained the situation to my new principal and stated that I would stay on if my leaving would put him in a difficult spot. He said if he had the chance I had, he'd go as well.
At my current school, I told my principal before I started looking. In fact, I had to tell her so she could complete the confidential reference with my agency. I told HR as well, though I still have not resigned, and won't until I have a contract in hand. Everyone has been very supportive and even envious.
I do agree with you, though. In every school I've worked except the one I'm in now, the principal would be the last person to ask about me as a teacher and often as a person.
The first time I went abroad I had just gotten hired on by a school in my dream district. Before I took the job abroad, I explained the situation to my new principal and stated that I would stay on if my leaving would put him in a difficult spot. He said if he had the chance I had, he'd go as well.
At my current school, I told my principal before I started looking. In fact, I had to tell her so she could complete the confidential reference with my agency. I told HR as well, though I still have not resigned, and won't until I have a contract in hand. Everyone has been very supportive and even envious.
I do agree with you, though. In every school I've worked except the one I'm in now, the principal would be the last person to ask about me as a teacher and often as a person.
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Re: Current Employer References
Dredge wrote:
> Are you in a public school in the US? If you are, I would assume you have
> nothing to worry about. Usually, in US public schools you have to sign a
> letter of intent in say, April, before you sign your contract in June for
> the following school year. To me, as an Admin, if you cannot provide the
> reference we are asking for then 1) you are hiding something or 2) you are
> not seriously considering the job.
>
> If you have some complicated story as to why you can't or prefer not to
> supply a specific reference, it then appears overly dramatic, which is a
> red flag.
>
> I hope you make the choice that is best for you.
Yes, I'm in a US school - and no I'm not hiding anything. This is my first time going through such a process and it just felt old that they would want to speak to a principal. I especially didn't want to cause friction, hurt my position by stating I was looking to go abroad. I have had excellent observations and great feedback from administrators. However, the principal is hardly around and wouldn't be the best reference.
> Are you in a public school in the US? If you are, I would assume you have
> nothing to worry about. Usually, in US public schools you have to sign a
> letter of intent in say, April, before you sign your contract in June for
> the following school year. To me, as an Admin, if you cannot provide the
> reference we are asking for then 1) you are hiding something or 2) you are
> not seriously considering the job.
>
> If you have some complicated story as to why you can't or prefer not to
> supply a specific reference, it then appears overly dramatic, which is a
> red flag.
>
> I hope you make the choice that is best for you.
Yes, I'm in a US school - and no I'm not hiding anything. This is my first time going through such a process and it just felt old that they would want to speak to a principal. I especially didn't want to cause friction, hurt my position by stating I was looking to go abroad. I have had excellent observations and great feedback from administrators. However, the principal is hardly around and wouldn't be the best reference.
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Re: Current Employer References
Wonder wrote:
> I completely agree with Dredge. If you are in a public school in the US,
> and probably even if you are in a private school, you have nothing to worry
> about. For one thing, you are not leaving your school to go to another
> school in the district, which might indicate that you are unhappy with your
> school or your admin. You are possibly leaving your school to go abroad!
> There is no insult and anyone worth their salt would be supportive of you
> doing that.
>
> The first time I went abroad I had just gotten hired on by a school in my
> dream district. Before I took the job abroad, I explained the situation to
> my new principal and stated that I would stay on if my leaving would put
> him in a difficult spot. He said if he had the chance I had, he'd go as
> well.
>
> At my current school, I told my principal before I started looking. In
> fact, I had to tell her so she could complete the confidential reference
> with my agency. I told HR as well, though I still have not resigned, and
> won't until I have a contract in hand. Everyone has been very supportive
> and even envious.
>
> I do agree with you, though. In every school I've worked except the one I'm
> in now, the principal would be the last person to ask about me as a teacher
> and often as a person.
New to the process and the principal lacks knowledge of much of what goes on in her own school.
> I completely agree with Dredge. If you are in a public school in the US,
> and probably even if you are in a private school, you have nothing to worry
> about. For one thing, you are not leaving your school to go to another
> school in the district, which might indicate that you are unhappy with your
> school or your admin. You are possibly leaving your school to go abroad!
> There is no insult and anyone worth their salt would be supportive of you
> doing that.
>
> The first time I went abroad I had just gotten hired on by a school in my
> dream district. Before I took the job abroad, I explained the situation to
> my new principal and stated that I would stay on if my leaving would put
> him in a difficult spot. He said if he had the chance I had, he'd go as
> well.
>
> At my current school, I told my principal before I started looking. In
> fact, I had to tell her so she could complete the confidential reference
> with my agency. I told HR as well, though I still have not resigned, and
> won't until I have a contract in hand. Everyone has been very supportive
> and even envious.
>
> I do agree with you, though. In every school I've worked except the one I'm
> in now, the principal would be the last person to ask about me as a teacher
> and often as a person.
New to the process and the principal lacks knowledge of much of what goes on in her own school.
Reply
@business88
Again though, if there is anything wrong about an IT the principal is going to know and in a lot of cases would be the only person who may know. if you were being investigated by your DS for anything or there were complaints lodged against you or anything that would be an issue of professional discipline, the only person in a DS who would be able to comment on it would be the principal. That information isnt going to be made available to HODs, coordinators or even associate/assistant/vice/deputy principals or deans. Thats why they need to ask your principal, they already know you can teach, and collaborate, and manage a classroom.
Again though, if there is anything wrong about an IT the principal is going to know and in a lot of cases would be the only person who may know. if you were being investigated by your DS for anything or there were complaints lodged against you or anything that would be an issue of professional discipline, the only person in a DS who would be able to comment on it would be the principal. That information isnt going to be made available to HODs, coordinators or even associate/assistant/vice/deputy principals or deans. Thats why they need to ask your principal, they already know you can teach, and collaborate, and manage a classroom.
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business88
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:54 pm
Re: Current Employer References
Thanks PsyGuy!
I get where you're coming from and understand that the principal would know certain information that others would not be privy to and that's why I went ahead and gave the director the contact information.
As I have never done this before, I was worried and a bit hesitant. It's not common in the US, for employers to speak directly to your current boss.
I get where you're coming from and understand that the principal would know certain information that others would not be privy to and that's why I went ahead and gave the director the contact information.
As I have never done this before, I was worried and a bit hesitant. It's not common in the US, for employers to speak directly to your current boss.
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Dredge
- Posts: 123
- Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:25 pm
- Location: Three continents, mentally and physically
Re: Current Employer References
business88 wrote:
> Thanks PsyGuy!
>
>
> As I have never done this before, I was worried and a bit hesitant. It's not common
> in the US, for employers to speak directly to your current boss.
Since when?
> Thanks PsyGuy!
>
>
> As I have never done this before, I was worried and a bit hesitant. It's not common
> in the US, for employers to speak directly to your current boss.
Since when?