I have a master's in STEM in the US and I think teaching math or science at a university may be for me because I've taught as a TA in grad school for 2 years. I also think I might like teaching at a university better than at an international school teaching kids/high schoolers because I won't have to deal with brats, parents complaining, unsupportive admin, etc. I'm interested in teaching in Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan and China. I'll also consider Europe and South America. I have some questions
1. What countries would be willing to hire me right now, given that I have an MS but I don't have any teaching licenses/credentials and don't want to spend another year getting a Master's in Education?
2. How common is it to end up teaching at a place with toxic conditions?
3. I heard university jobs are only around 20 hours/week. Is it common to teach multiple univ teaching jobs? how much of the time is spent with students, preparing lessons, dealing with coworker teachers and politics, and other time?
4. How does it compare to typical office jobs in the US? Do you still feel like your job is soulless and you're just a cog in the machine? Is univ teaching abroad really stressful, even more so than than most professions?
5. Would you say university teachers are more/less miserable than other people you know?
6. What are the long-term career paths I could get into after starting off teaching?
7. Do you get the same benefits of yearly tickets home, housing allowance, and 11-14 weeks of vacation a year that international school teachers get?
Teaching math/science at universities abroad?
Response
First, being a TA is very different from being the faculty of record in a Uni, well its not very different, but its different enough.
Second, Uni students can be even more bratty than secondary IS/DS students. In many of the regions you listed (Asia) students spend all of their childhood essentially getting into the best Uni they can, after they are in it can easily be X number of years of them coasting, it doesnt matter what grades they get, it matters the name of the Uni on their degree and the alumni network they will have access too.
1) Teaching science/maths/engineering would be very few. These programs are almost all taught in the host nation language, so unless youre a native speaker in complex academic subjects in the hard sciences Unis wont be interested in you within those departments. What host nation Uni interest you will find is going to be in the modern language department (ESOL) where you might be assigned to an ESOL class within other divisions/departments, or doing editing/reading work of publications for other faculty who are submitting them in English to various journals. Its not uncommon to have one or two courses and the rest of your tasking is editing and various document production. Otherwise the departments that would appoint an expat to faculty would be in various international divisions such as "business" or various degrees in humanities/liberal arts that have "studies" in there name.
The other option is the handful of western "academies" attached to various host nation Unis that specifically offer English/Western programs and degrees (U. Nottingham in China is an example, etc.). Most of them are in international business or international studies. Where a portion of the coursework is provided in the host nation language and another portion of the course is provided by the western academy. Usually these academies award a western degree to the student.
You dont need an M.Ed to teach at Uni, you need a doctorate.
The issue is that with a Masters only the Asian Unis would be interested and only in the aforementioned ESOL programs or international academies. You would need a doctorate and near fluent host language competency for your application to be taken seriously.
2) Define Toxic? Your going to be one of the low faculty on the bottom of the hierarchy. Expats generally get contract appointments which are essentially one year, full time adjunct appointments, but as long as there arent any serious complaints you will have a lot of autonomy. Also understand that many students will be taking your course because its required or they think its an easy course, and if you make it more difficult than there expectations it will be swimming against the current. You cant fail anyone, they will just complain your a bad teacher, if you dont negotiate extra credit, or a redo.
If your class is a dull boring lecture of vocabulary and structure students will essentially put into their work what you put into your course. If you make it engaging and meaningful youll get more out of them.
You will have about one department meeting a month, and it will mostly be HR and administrative issues. You really only see your chair if theres a problem, so no contact means you are doing well.
3) 20 hours or less, depending on your research, and what relationship you have with the faculty chair and division dean. Its common to have a full teaching load your first year and after that to be able to get writing or research scheduled blocks. Also understand that office hours can be pretty hands on, its free tutoring for students and they will avail themselves of that time. Aside from that its not unreasonable to have a teaching load closer to 12-14 hours a week.
Its difficult to generalize across all those regions, you can get contract appointments in a Rajabhat in Thailand at a salary of THB 18K-THB 20K, which is nothing and about half what an ET makes in an ES. The teaching load is very small about 12 hours a week, allowing you to take multiple appointments. There is an opposite extreme in JP for example where you can make ¥10M depending on the Uni on a multi year appointment.
You generally have 1-5 office hours or consulting periods a week. You have 1 department and 1 division meeting a month on average. Expats at the meeting means the meeting has to be in English and slows everything down.
Most colleagues dont stick around when they dont have to be unless they are working on a degree themselves, and then they tend to live in the department.
Politics is more about keeping your students happy than anything else. Occasionally you can bank some political coin by doing weekend activities, usually some kind of speech competition. Say good things to all participants and pick the team with the cutest girl as the winner.
4) You arent even a cog, a cog is necessary for operation of the system, if you fall off the end of the earth no one will notice, or blink longer than it takes to appoint a replacement.
It has perks, you can socialize with students, and the commons has a lot of energy. For many Asians Uni is there first real freedom since they started primary. This is why when you meet many Asians all there closest friends were from early childhood. They either conform and dedicate their life to studying to get into the best Uni they can or they rebel.
It can be pretty soulless, imagine giving a lecture on field specific vocabulary and not a sound but yours and the blinking of a several hundred students. Most of them will be on their phones.
Its not stressful as long as you understand that your purpose is presence, trying to implement or maintain some standards of rigor, performance, learning will just frustrate and disappoint you. If your comfortable being human tape recorder than its not stressful at all.
5) They generally are more miserable if their addiction/vice is an indication. Its hard to generalize because the job can be very different. Are you working on a degree yourself, are you writing and researching, or are you just a white face. What really gets most of them is the stress of figuring out what they are going to do next. Many Unis by regulation or policy have limits on how long appointments can be. After a certain number of years you have to move to another Uni, and its rare to ever get tenure, especially for a lecturer with only a Masters.
6) None, thats part of the stress, the only real goal in Uni is tenure, and as a contract instructor/lecturer your juggling courses and trying to get some research/writing in on the side so that when your contract is up for review you have something to put under publications, all while keeping your students happy, even if they dont do any work. Unless your working at a Western Academy at a Uni youll never make administration without a doctorate.
7) No you dont get OSH benefits at a Uni, you get the same package as all other faculty with the exception of getting a visa, which is essentially an LH package. Some of the western academies do provide OSH packages that include relocation at start and end of employment and housing (though the housing is often on campus and is more like a dormitory than an apartment IE.. "Panda House"). You will get summers off, but its usually unpaid. You salary isnt annualized and is typically a 10 month contract. What summer course opportunities are available usually have more faculty who want it then there are courses available.
Second, Uni students can be even more bratty than secondary IS/DS students. In many of the regions you listed (Asia) students spend all of their childhood essentially getting into the best Uni they can, after they are in it can easily be X number of years of them coasting, it doesnt matter what grades they get, it matters the name of the Uni on their degree and the alumni network they will have access too.
1) Teaching science/maths/engineering would be very few. These programs are almost all taught in the host nation language, so unless youre a native speaker in complex academic subjects in the hard sciences Unis wont be interested in you within those departments. What host nation Uni interest you will find is going to be in the modern language department (ESOL) where you might be assigned to an ESOL class within other divisions/departments, or doing editing/reading work of publications for other faculty who are submitting them in English to various journals. Its not uncommon to have one or two courses and the rest of your tasking is editing and various document production. Otherwise the departments that would appoint an expat to faculty would be in various international divisions such as "business" or various degrees in humanities/liberal arts that have "studies" in there name.
The other option is the handful of western "academies" attached to various host nation Unis that specifically offer English/Western programs and degrees (U. Nottingham in China is an example, etc.). Most of them are in international business or international studies. Where a portion of the coursework is provided in the host nation language and another portion of the course is provided by the western academy. Usually these academies award a western degree to the student.
You dont need an M.Ed to teach at Uni, you need a doctorate.
The issue is that with a Masters only the Asian Unis would be interested and only in the aforementioned ESOL programs or international academies. You would need a doctorate and near fluent host language competency for your application to be taken seriously.
2) Define Toxic? Your going to be one of the low faculty on the bottom of the hierarchy. Expats generally get contract appointments which are essentially one year, full time adjunct appointments, but as long as there arent any serious complaints you will have a lot of autonomy. Also understand that many students will be taking your course because its required or they think its an easy course, and if you make it more difficult than there expectations it will be swimming against the current. You cant fail anyone, they will just complain your a bad teacher, if you dont negotiate extra credit, or a redo.
If your class is a dull boring lecture of vocabulary and structure students will essentially put into their work what you put into your course. If you make it engaging and meaningful youll get more out of them.
You will have about one department meeting a month, and it will mostly be HR and administrative issues. You really only see your chair if theres a problem, so no contact means you are doing well.
3) 20 hours or less, depending on your research, and what relationship you have with the faculty chair and division dean. Its common to have a full teaching load your first year and after that to be able to get writing or research scheduled blocks. Also understand that office hours can be pretty hands on, its free tutoring for students and they will avail themselves of that time. Aside from that its not unreasonable to have a teaching load closer to 12-14 hours a week.
Its difficult to generalize across all those regions, you can get contract appointments in a Rajabhat in Thailand at a salary of THB 18K-THB 20K, which is nothing and about half what an ET makes in an ES. The teaching load is very small about 12 hours a week, allowing you to take multiple appointments. There is an opposite extreme in JP for example where you can make ¥10M depending on the Uni on a multi year appointment.
You generally have 1-5 office hours or consulting periods a week. You have 1 department and 1 division meeting a month on average. Expats at the meeting means the meeting has to be in English and slows everything down.
Most colleagues dont stick around when they dont have to be unless they are working on a degree themselves, and then they tend to live in the department.
Politics is more about keeping your students happy than anything else. Occasionally you can bank some political coin by doing weekend activities, usually some kind of speech competition. Say good things to all participants and pick the team with the cutest girl as the winner.
4) You arent even a cog, a cog is necessary for operation of the system, if you fall off the end of the earth no one will notice, or blink longer than it takes to appoint a replacement.
It has perks, you can socialize with students, and the commons has a lot of energy. For many Asians Uni is there first real freedom since they started primary. This is why when you meet many Asians all there closest friends were from early childhood. They either conform and dedicate their life to studying to get into the best Uni they can or they rebel.
It can be pretty soulless, imagine giving a lecture on field specific vocabulary and not a sound but yours and the blinking of a several hundred students. Most of them will be on their phones.
Its not stressful as long as you understand that your purpose is presence, trying to implement or maintain some standards of rigor, performance, learning will just frustrate and disappoint you. If your comfortable being human tape recorder than its not stressful at all.
5) They generally are more miserable if their addiction/vice is an indication. Its hard to generalize because the job can be very different. Are you working on a degree yourself, are you writing and researching, or are you just a white face. What really gets most of them is the stress of figuring out what they are going to do next. Many Unis by regulation or policy have limits on how long appointments can be. After a certain number of years you have to move to another Uni, and its rare to ever get tenure, especially for a lecturer with only a Masters.
6) None, thats part of the stress, the only real goal in Uni is tenure, and as a contract instructor/lecturer your juggling courses and trying to get some research/writing in on the side so that when your contract is up for review you have something to put under publications, all while keeping your students happy, even if they dont do any work. Unless your working at a Western Academy at a Uni youll never make administration without a doctorate.
7) No you dont get OSH benefits at a Uni, you get the same package as all other faculty with the exception of getting a visa, which is essentially an LH package. Some of the western academies do provide OSH packages that include relocation at start and end of employment and housing (though the housing is often on campus and is more like a dormitory than an apartment IE.. "Panda House"). You will get summers off, but its usually unpaid. You salary isnt annualized and is typically a 10 month contract. What summer course opportunities are available usually have more faculty who want it then there are courses available.
Re: Teaching math/science at universities abroad?
From my personal experience (which apparently is completely different to PsyGuy's...):
1. This is dependent on the college, not the country. You want to look at colleges/university that have programs in English OR (ideally) are affiliated with a US university.
2. As common as any other job as an expat. Do your due diligence.
3. This will depend on the university. My job is 12 teaching hours a week, plus 4 lab hours and 4 office hours. I also spend about 4 hours a week preparing for lectures. I don't see the other teachers unless we're in the office together, so the interpersonal drama I have to deal with compared to my high school job is minimal.
4. Teaching is a stressful job regardless of the level. And yes, you are going to be a cog in the system to some extend. However, I do feel like I am having some effect on my students lives, and that makes it worth it to me.
5. I can only speak for the teachers I personally know, but the ones that are happy people are happy and the ones that would be miserable anywhere aren't.
6. Unless you're planning to get a Ph.D, you're going to be limited to lower-level college courses. You could always go into industry though, if you decide teaching isn't for you.
7. I do, but again, this is going to depend on the school.
1. This is dependent on the college, not the country. You want to look at colleges/university that have programs in English OR (ideally) are affiliated with a US university.
2. As common as any other job as an expat. Do your due diligence.
3. This will depend on the university. My job is 12 teaching hours a week, plus 4 lab hours and 4 office hours. I also spend about 4 hours a week preparing for lectures. I don't see the other teachers unless we're in the office together, so the interpersonal drama I have to deal with compared to my high school job is minimal.
4. Teaching is a stressful job regardless of the level. And yes, you are going to be a cog in the system to some extend. However, I do feel like I am having some effect on my students lives, and that makes it worth it to me.
5. I can only speak for the teachers I personally know, but the ones that are happy people are happy and the ones that would be miserable anywhere aren't.
6. Unless you're planning to get a Ph.D, you're going to be limited to lower-level college courses. You could always go into industry though, if you decide teaching isn't for you.
7. I do, but again, this is going to depend on the school.
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shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
Re: Teaching math/science at universities abroad?
If you want to teach at a uni, but don't have a degree to do so, you are usually looking for an English teaching gig.
If you want to teach STEM, Malaysia has their own STEM graduates, etc etc etc.
Sorry to pop your bubble, but getting picked up as a STEM instructor at a foreign university, unless it is a US affiliate in Dubai, Qatar, or Kuwait, isn't too likely.
In those countries - check them out and see.
If you want to teach STEM, Malaysia has their own STEM graduates, etc etc etc.
Sorry to pop your bubble, but getting picked up as a STEM instructor at a foreign university, unless it is a US affiliate in Dubai, Qatar, or Kuwait, isn't too likely.
In those countries - check them out and see.