Harvard's CSML

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fine dude
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Harvard's CSML

Post by fine dude »

Is the 'Certificate in School Management and Leadership' from Harvard of any use in securing a middle/high school principal position at a top-tier school if one already has a master's in ed and some middle management experience? Does anyone on this forum has a first-hand account of success with the said qualification? Thanks in advance.
sid
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by sid »

I worked with a teacher who had one and who spoke highly of the program. Based on our conversations, he had learned a lot that would be useful in leadership.
We both moved on to other schools and lost touch. I never heard any reports of him landing a leadership post.
fine dude
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by fine dude »

Thanks sid. That's what I thought. Not any different from PTC. Admin credential is the way to go, I guess.
chemteacher101
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by chemteacher101 »

I've been getting several interviews for roles above my current one based on it. As many things, it will vary depending on the recruiter.
sid
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by sid »

Won’t hurt, could help. Nothing is a guarantee.
mamava
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by mamava »

The fact that Harvard is attached to it will garner a 2nd look. Like most PD or additional degrees (and, I suppose, in other areas) it's not what you have, it's how you use it.
sid
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by sid »

So many times I’ve seen variations on the theme of “I earned my credential, I told my principal, now I’ll sit in my classroom and wait for my new position to be delivered to me”. I saw a new variant just the other day in a Facebook leadership group: the poster had decided to go into leadership, was considering earning a credential, and wanted to know whether to take a position in another school or just tell her current school to create a new position for her, specific to what she wanted to do. Oh my.
Moral of the story: nobody is handing out leadership positions. Wait for it to come to you, and you’ll wait forever. Start leading, contributing, taking initiative. The job goes to the person who was already doing it before it was open.
Credentials can help. Action speaks louder.
fine dude
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by fine dude »

Good points, gentlemen. The problem is there are many folks who are leading and taking the initiative and despite having the experience and credentials, it could be a stroke of luck or the right connection that can get you the first break.
sid
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Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:44 am

Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by sid »

You’re right. It does take luck. There are always more people who want leadership positions than there are available leadership positions. It’s hard getting one, especially that first one, and the process can feel brutal. Love and support to everyone going through this.
As for connections, there can be some luck there too, but quite a bit of that you can control or at least influence. Build a network. Maintain it over the long term. We all meet people. Do you build bonds, make connections, reach out regularly, and not just when you’re hoping someone can help you? There’s a huge difference you can make for yourself and have your connections in place when your moment arises.
PsyGuy
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Response

Post by PsyGuy »

Absolutely, the Harvard CSML has more utility than a typical leadership credential (NPQ/DOE Admin credential). There are third tier ISs that will and have given a new leaders the keys with no actual classroom or DE/IE experience just on the strength of the certificate coming from a global ivy.
You can do both though. The MA Provisional (Entry grade) Superintendent credential requires only passing the communication literacy exam, a Bachelors/first degree and 3 years experience including teaching experience. No Advanced degree or EPP program is required.

There are 3 general avenues into leadership:
1) Grow In: You start at an IS as an IT, you work well with leadership, parents and ownership, and then when there is an opening you get the job because ownership trusts you and leadership and parents like you. This pathway is faster at lower tier ISs, where there is a lot of turnover and longevity often means your only one of the few staff to renew.
2) Work In: You get a M.Ed in Ed.Ld, you add a credential, you build some leadership or management experience and you work your way up into leadership. This may and often requires some work in DE. This is the pathway that accounts for the majority of leadership. Candidates were leadership in DE, and they were hired as leadership in IE.
3) Edge In: You make friends and build a network, maybe you marry into, but someone in ownership likes you and gives you the job, or someone in leadership helps you get into the job. This is the least common path into leadership.

Leadership roles are defined by reports, peer deliverables, or resource budgeting and allocation. The most difficult part of the process is getting that first opportunity. Once you have some experience though moving around in leadership is considerably less difficult.
JDK
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by JDK »

I finished up the program a few months ago and really enjoyed it for the most part. A lot of the content is excellent, and the case studies also typically provide good context. The specific strategies and models they describe provide the greatest value, or at least they did for me, and can be put into practice immediately.

However, I would add two big caveats. First, very little screening takes place in terms of entry to the program. If you can pay and hold any position within an education-related field, you're very likely going to be accepted. As a result, the quality of engagement with others can be almost comically poor at times. Many participants submit the bare minimum both in their responses and for the required comments on others' work. Second, the commenting system itself doesn't lend itself to a good experience. Going back to your own responses is easy. Trying to track down a reply to your comment on someone else's post is a pain, which is strange considering that's the type of dialogue they're trying to encourage.

In short, you'll get what you put into it. As others have said, it's a nice item to add to your CV due to the name, but don't expect it to be life changing or an automatic ticket to leadership. That depends more on what you do with what you've learned.
fine dude
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by fine dude »

Thank you all.
@JDK
If you have to do it all over again, would you enrol in the same course or a different one? I have heard Australia offers some pretty rigorous options.
PsyGuy
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Discussion

Post by PsyGuy »

I tend to agree with @JDK, the courses as organized are very well done, the participation component of colleagues is lacking in a lot of aspects. The vast majority just do the required amount, but thats what happens in asynchronous remote learning courses. The admission requirements are essentially anyone that really wants to enter the program and can pay the coin will get in. There are participants whose background is "consultant" who have no real other leadership background and you can tell from their responses they don't really have any applicable history or experience to pull from. One highly thought participant had a Masters from Oxford in Education and not only had they never supervised faculty or staff or had any leadership experience they had no classroom experience as an edu. They had never set foot in a classroom. They went from their graduate degree program to work in research, curriculum development and consulting.

Where I disagree with @JDK is the value in having a qualification from a Global Ivy, there is ownership and ISs that will give you headship and the keys just based on that. The idea of being able to claim their HOS is a graduate of or certified leader from a Global Ivy is just too valuable.

Name dropping Harvard or another Global Ivy over an AUS Uni is far more valuable in marketability and utility than the quality and increased learning you will get out of an AUS Uni.
JDK
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by JDK »

@fine dude: Despite the shortcomings, I would still probably do it given how inexpensive it is (which was covered by my school through our PD budget regardless) and the value of the content. However, I'm definitely still looking for other opportunities that are, you put it, more rigorous. This is also one of the cases where I do agree with PsyGuy to an extent: in some situations/schools you may very well have an opportunity you wouldn't have otherwise because of the name recognition.
fine dude
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Re: Harvard's CSML

Post by fine dude »

Thanks for weighing in, JDK. Appreciate it.
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