PGCE or TeachNow for QTS/professional teaching credential

[Spartan177]

Hi All,

I am a non-US/UK resident who is planning to make a career switch to teaching Mathematics. Currently discussing with a school about the possibility of joining as a trainee teacher. Which path would be the most ideal to get a permanent professional teaching credential or QTS?

1) TeachNow path:
a) Get the DC credential. Apply for UK QTS as an OTT. As many have pointed out, this route likely will be denied.
b) get the DC credential. Work for 3 years and apply for HI standard license. Then apply for QTS as an OTT. will this likely be denied as well?
c) get the DC credential. work for 3 years and apply for HI standard license and renew it every 5 years. I am not sure whether there are any restrictions on the number of times a non-US resident can renew the license.

2) PGCE from Uni of Sunderland
a) Use the PGCE as CT experiential route to get an entry-level credential after 3 years of working. Then apply for HI standard license and QTS. If 1)b) gets denied, I presume this too will get denied right?
b) Get the PGCE and apply for AO QTS somewhere down the road.

Any other potential pathways for a permanent professional credential? I am drawn towards 1)b) but I have concerns that without teaching experience in the US, this too will be denied down the road like 1)a).

Thanks a lot for your input :)

[s0830887]

Definitely route 1a. QTS is now being awarded to TN graduates with DC licenses, TN worked hard to get that rejection business overturned. I was awarded QTS a few months ago on my DC license having done my student teaching outside of the US (this was the crux of the issue), and being rejected with the same exact application documents a year prior.

Another reason for DC over HI is that non-US teachers with HI licenses are currently being rejected for QTS because HI is claiming that without a social security number, HI cannot verify that the teacher has no sanctions against them in the NASDTEC database, therefore they cannot issue a letter of good standing as is required for QTS. This is not true, you do not need a SSN to search the database, but it is happening and who knows how long it will take to fix. So, you should avoid HI for now. TN is already trying to figure it out but it might take awhile. As far as I've heard, this is only happening with HI teachers who don't have SSN and not DC. But, if you haven't figured out from my post yet, if you have any issues with reciprocity, TN WILL work to fix them for you.

[Spartan177]

[quote=s0830887 post_id=59853 time=1602351905 user_id=207549]
Definitely route 1a. QTS is now being awarded to TN graduates with DC licenses, TN worked hard to get that rejection business overturned. I was awarded QTS a few months ago on my DC license having done my student teaching outside of the US (this was the crux of the issue), and being rejected with the same exact application documents a year prior.

Another reason for DC over HI is that non-US teachers with HI licenses are currently being rejected for QTS because HI is claiming that without a social security number, HI cannot verify that the teacher has no sanctions against them in the NASDTEC database, therefore they cannot issue a letter of good standing as is required for QTS. This is not true, you do not need a SSN to search the database, but it is happening and who knows how long it will take to fix. So, you should avoid HI for now. TN is already trying to figure it out but it might take awhile. As far as I've heard, this is only happening with HI teachers who don't have SSN and not DC. But, if you haven't figured out from my post yet, if you have any issues with reciprocity, TN WILL work to fix them for you.
[/quote]

Thanks s0830887! I guess 1a seems to be the best option as of now.

[evilharo]

Nice to hear that! I posted a similar question a few months ago and the general consensus at that point was that it became hard, if not impossible, to get QTS through the TN DC license. Can you give more detail what happened to turn it around? What did TN do and how did they help you to get QTS?

s0830887 wrote:
> Definitely route 1a. QTS is now being awarded to TN graduates with DC
> licenses, TN worked hard to get that rejection business overturned. I was
> awarded QTS a few months ago on my DC license having done my student
> teaching outside of the US (this was the crux of the issue), and being
> rejected with the same exact application documents a year prior.
>
> Another reason for DC over HI is that non-US teachers with HI licenses are
> currently being rejected for QTS because HI is claiming that without a
> social security number, HI cannot verify that the teacher has no sanctions
> against them in the NASDTEC database, therefore they cannot issue a letter
> of good standing as is required for QTS. This is not true, you do not need
> a SSN to search the database, but it is happening and who knows how long it
> will take to fix. So, you should avoid HI for now. TN is already trying to
> figure it out but it might take awhile. As far as I've heard, this is only
> happening with HI teachers who don't have SSN and not DC. But, if you
> haven't figured out from my post yet, if you have any issues with
> reciprocity, TN WILL work to fix them for you.

[FuzzyBear2017]

How much does route 1a cost?
How long does route 1a take?

[scooter93]

Not trying to hijack this thread, but this raised a question for me:

If you have a US teaching certification and then get QTS, is it really difficult to get certified again in the US? In case you wanted to go back home eventually.

[Smoko]

evilharo wrote:
> Nice to hear that! I posted a similar question a few months ago and the general
> consensus at that point was that it became hard, if not impossible, to get QTS
> through the TN DC license. Can you give more detail what happened to turn it around?
> What did TN do and how did they help you to get QTS?

I was lucky enough not to have any issues with my QTS application and it was approved without question, but from following the Teach-Now Facebook group, it looks like people who were initially rejected for QTS were subsequently emailed by Teach-Now recommending that they reapply. They were advised to upload a letter from the CEO as one of their supporting documents. Not sure if that's still needed or whether people are back to being immediately approved. It looks good for now, but all of this comes with the caveat that it could change at any point in the future.


FuzzyBear2017 wrote:
> How much does route 1a cost?
> How long does route 1a take?

$6000 USD + Praxis exams and background check (under $500).


scooter93 wrote:
If you have a US teaching certification and then get QTS, is it really
> difficult to get certified again in the US? In case you wanted to go back
> home eventually.

QTS is separate from the US teaching licence, and you can keep both active at the same time. QTS doesn't expire or require renewal. The Washington DC licence can be renewed either by PD or retaking one of the Praxis exams every 4 years.

[PsyGuy]

1A) Is likely to be denied.
The TCL/TRA still routinely denies QTS to those who didnt complete field experience in the region of the regulating authority such as Teach Now. Teach Now didnt really do anything other than write a letter, even the OSSE didnt take a position. What has happened is that the Dfe has larger issues than litigate what is currently an interpretation thats being enforced by little more than a memo. Thats not to say its no longer an issue, just that the Dfe is waiting to see how the effects of Brexit effect the DT pool. If enough of those UK DTs have to return and that shrinks the DT shortage then were very likely to see the current interpretation made more official and formal, in addition to other changes to mutual recognition, which is what the smart coin is on. If you were applying now as in the case of @evilharo as well, you might (coin flip) be able to gt QTS out of it, but your not. The Teach Now program is 9 (too 10) months, by then Brexit will be resolved. If you think Teach Now or Moreland Uni. is going to dictate anything to the TCL/TRA bad on a piece of stationary from the CEO, thats nutter talk. One, Teach Now doesnt have the clout of the UK Unis and all of there edu departments that are highly opposed to it. Second, they would be cutting their own throats. Who would spend 2 years doing an ITT/EPP program and induction with the risk of failing induction, when they could forgo induction and gt th whole thing done in a year. It would gut there whole approach to professional edu training.
Thats not to say things couldnt go that way. They could all turn out swimmingly in favor of OTT QTS over it, its just not smart coin on it happening that way right now.

2B) Is likely to be denied as well, because in three years time (by the time you have the HI credential after 3 years of experience) you will need a letter of completing domestic field experience by then regardless of where you apply from.
You would have a better probability of getting QTS starting with the HI credential from Teach Now to begin with, but thats only if your starting now and can be a program completer by Summer of 2021.
The HI credential is a year longer anyway (5 years vs. 4 years), but there re-certification isnt as straightforward, though potentially less costly than DC. HI has a competency based system whereas DC does not.

1C) Is certainly an option, you can forgo the DC credential and obtain the HI credential directly using Teach Now. After 5 years when you renew if youve been teaching all those 5 years and obtain a Masters degree you will be eligible for the HI Advance credential which is valid for 10 years.

There are no restrictions on how many times you can renew the HI or DC credential. Though you could look at transferring to a region such as CA that doesnt require PD (effective lifetime credentials).

Regardless however Teach Now is a perfectly valid route of getting a professional edu credential from the US, which you will still have going into the future, and may very well be a reliable pathway into getting QTS. Even if its not you still have a professional edu credential.

2A) Possible, but unlikely. You technically only need two (not three) years of experience, but the PGCE (I assume you refer to the Academic PGCE) is going to take a year. In practice three years is a more solid application, and this all depends where your experience is from. This assumes its still available by that time, there are some rumblings that this route might be going away.
However by this time youre likely going to need a letter confirming where your field experience took place, though it would be easier to obscure.

2B) Yes. This is the surest method of getting QTS outside of Sch.Dir. or a Professional PGCE. Its also the most expensive as you have to pay for the PGCE (GB£7500) and the AO program (GB£3000). You could save some coin by getting a Masters from somewhere like UPe (USD$3200), which recently increased their course fee, reducing the academic portion costs for the AO portfolio (and a Masters would further compensate you with a higher salary band in IE). Though there are candidates who obtain QTS vie AO that dont have an academic background in edu.
Regardless after completing the AO program you will be a NQT and still have a induction requirement, though outside of the top tier BSs full QTS doesnt have as much utility.

Another option is Teach Ready from FL. They wont issue you a credential but they will issue you a letter of program (ITT/EPP) completion. You can then us that letter to get a HI provisional credential and then a standard credential. The difference is that Teach Now requires a 12 week field experience and Teach Ready only 5 days which is much easier to do if you dont currently have a classroom appointment.
Still has the same problems as Teach Now with QTS, though this pathway is less known currently.

Yet another option is you could get the MA provisional credential. This would be an effective lifetime credential, and there is no ITT/EPP program nor field experience requirement. You only have to pass the credentialing exams. You would not be able to us this for QTS as is. The cost would be about USD$1000, mostly for travel (flight costs) to take the exams. You could professionalize this after 3 years of experience and then obtaining the HI standard credential.

There is no reason to avoid HI. You no longer need a letter from HI to apply for QTS. HI instituted a public online credential portal over the summer of 2020. This is all you need to identify your credential to the TCL/TRA in the OTT application.

Teach Nows program is USD$6K plus PRAXIS and application costs. its takes 9-10 months.

It depends if you let your credential expire or not. Assuming you do, it depends what state. Some just look at reinstating as completing the renewal requirements whatever thy currently are. Some make you reapply as a new applicant and having to meet whatever the current requirements are. You can maintain both. However as long as your teaching what your academic qualification is there usually isnt a need to maintain the US credential.
You can use QTS to get a US teaching credential. Its typically accepted as meeting the EPP/ITT requirements, usually leaving testing as a deficiency. You may be able to use previous test scores (PRAXIS, etc.) to meet the assessment requirement.

The DC credential is valid for 4 years, the HI standard 5 years (Advance 10 years and Provisional 3 years). HI has a competency or experience based renewal system. DC a experience, PD, or assessment based renewal system.

[s0830887]

[quote=PsyGuy post_id=59911 time=1602951765 user_id=68047]
There is no reason to avoid HI. You no longer need a letter from HI to apply for QTS. HI instituted a public online credential portal over the summer of 2020. This is all you need to identify your credential to the TCL/TRA in the OTT application.
[/quote]

This is incorrect.

[quote=Smoko post_id=59903 time=1602914228 user_id=247370]
I was lucky enough not to have any issues with my QTS application and it was approved without question, but from following the Teach-Now Facebook group, it looks like people who were initially rejected for QTS were subsequently emailed by Teach-Now recommending that they reapply. They were advised to upload a letter from the CEO as one of their supporting documents. Not sure if that's still needed or whether people are back to being immediately approved. It looks good for now, but all of this comes with the caveat that it could change at any point in the future.
[/quote]

I didn't need a letter, it was automatic. And I second that caveat. If you do TN, join the FB group and keep an eye on which way the wind is blowing.

Why do I suck at quotes.

[Unpredictablytrue]

I applied for my QTS from Texas last year and received it via email within a week. I don't remember the cost, but it wasn't overly expensive. At the time I had 12 years of teaching experience with certification in Language Arts, Reading, Social Studies, SPED, and EAL. My B.A. is in English, but I also have a MEd and MSEd in two different disciplines unrelated to the English degree. My advice is follow the directions to the "T." I have known people to get turned away purely for the fact that they missed something.

[PsyGuy]

@s0830887

No its correct.