Question about School Counselor Credentials

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dannydecha
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2020 4:33 pm

Question about School Counselor Credentials

Post by dannydecha »

Hello,

I would love some advice and potential answers from anyone who could help. I have tried researching and reached out to a lot of people, but I think I've pretty much hit a wall. There is a lot I don't know!

I am a South Korean citizen finishing up my MS.E in School Counseling from a program in the US. The only problem is... for my practicum supervision I need a U.S certified school counselor. I am currently working at an international school in South Korea, but there is no one here that can oversee my practicum. I was hired provisionally on the agreement that I would finish my degree within a certain period. Without this practicum I can not get my initial licensure (Which to my understanding from other posts seem to be critical).

I contacted my program director and was told that there is a non-license seeking Masters (MS.E in Counseling Foundations) that I can shift course to.

I tried to do my due diligence but I don't know, if the information I found is correct. I've also attached links to appropriate websites I've mentioned.

Here are my questions:
1) I took a look at the District of Columbia credentialing for school counselors. If I change my program to the non-license seeking, I am wondering if I can get the credentials through the OSSE as a non-US citizen? Will the MS.E in Counseling Foundations be considered a masters in 'counseling'? I already have experience as a school counselor and the degree covers the appropriate classes. https://osse.dc.gov/page/school-service ... #counselor

2) How important is the license? I do hear mixed things from different international school counselors. Some have said that a license is irrelevant in some ISs (But, all say that a Masters is crucial). In the end, I do not wish to teach in the U.S...

3) How are International School Counseling certificates from CTC, Lehigh University, or University of San Diego? Are they in the end just a piece of paper? Or could the certificate(s) support my case (for hiring) without a license but with a masters (this would be so freaking expensive)?
https://www.theptc.org/ctc-certificate
https://ed.lehigh.edu/academics/certifi ... ate-online
https://www.sandiego.edu/soles/counseli ... ounseling/

4) What does the license ensure in the ISs? Is it for a visa? The license only really has value in the specific state that it was issued from. There is no governing body for international schools and I feel like it doesn't really mean much, so I would love clarification on this as well!

Thank you!
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Response

Post by PsyGuy »

Have you exhausted all potential ISs? I would clarify with your Uni but could you network with a US School Counselor (SC) at another IS who could supervise remotely your practicum maybe add a couple of visits and meetup via virtually (Skype, etc.). I do not know if your Uni would find that acceptable, but others have been able to do so successfully.

In direct reply to your inquires:

1) Yes, you can get the SC credential as a non-citizen through DCs OSSE.
Yes, the MS.E in Counseling Foundations (really any degree that's primary focused on "counseling" is sufficient. Prior applicants have used various degrees in psychology to qualify, mainly clinical psychology). Assuming your degree covers the appropriate courses and you have the requisite experience (there is no practicum requirement, you can qualify with prior counseling or even teaching experience). You will need to take and pass the appropriate ETS/PRAXIS exam (Professional School Counselor, 5421). Its a difficult exam, applicants have studied for months in advance of taking it.

2) Whats your long term goals? I ask because you will need to complete PD for DC every four years to renew the credential and based on your pathway this credential isnt transferable to other states (mainly CA) as youre required to have completed a practicum to qualify for reciprocity. If youre okay with the PD and you stay in IE you shouldnt have any issues.
Just as for classroom ITs in lower tiers there is less of a requirement to hold a credential. Counselors can be hard to find some years and a practicing counselor without a credential with lots of applicable experience can get pretty far in IE without a current, valid credential. You will always have limitations though as you move up in tiers, ISS can be very selective and a lack of a credential is going to be an easy pass/bin when an IS has an ample pool of candidates and elite/first tier ISs in high desirability regions often have ample applicant pools.

3) They are just paper. You may as well add an IB workshop certificate into that group as well. Paper can impress leaders and recruiters (something like CTC and IB, have near cult followings), but youre kidding yourself if one of these certificates ill compensate for an actual credential. Most of them are for candidates who are trying to transition or already have transitioned into counseling on the cheap, who dont want to or cant get a full degree.

4) The credential admits you to the profession as a professional. When an IS requires you hold a credential, certificate or license from your HOR or a western authority the credential allows you to check that box, it makes you legal. This effects directly your marketability. As a license it authorizes you to provide school services within the capacity of the credential within the jurisdiction of the regulatory authority. Outside that jurisdiction however your not licensed for anything. Youre credentialed but your not licensed for anything. That credential though does have a varying degree of portability. You can use it to apply for a license in other jurisdictions. An appropriate license may increase your marketability and may critically also grant you various defenses and protections, such as privileged communication (many IE SCs erroneously believe their foreign SC credential is equal in effect to that of local MH professional, its not, youre basically a lay person), or access to professional practice insurance, etc.

You may have some visa issues without a credential, but they would be minor.
eion_padraig
Posts: 408
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm

Re: Question about School Counselor Credentials

Post by eion_padraig »

@dannydecha,

Are you in a city that may have other US certified school counselors? Maybe your program would let someone at a nearby school supervise you even while you work somewhere else? It's worth asking. Often there are city-wide or country-wide networks of international counselors that help support each other. I find that's been the case in my current city and my last city. It's worth asking, and then trying to track down someone to help if your program and your school would allow it.

For some principals the credential may ensure you are well trained, but I think if you have a master's for most principals it's a vehicle for a visa. There are some countries (Singapore is one) that you wouldn't be able to get a visa without a credential. I don't know how wide spread an issue that is, but it's best for flexibility and future changes in law that can happen to maintain one. For years it wasn't needed in Singapore and then they changed the laws and it was needed.

I know people working as school counselors with counseling training, but no credential. And I know other people like you that have been hired who are part way through the training. If they have good experience they're going to be marketable, except at places you need the credential for the visa.

Good luck.
interteach
Posts: 210
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 2:25 pm

Re: Question about School Counselor Credentials

Post by interteach »

There's already lots of good advice here. I want to chime in with two points.

Having the license will make a substantial difference in being able to be hired. It's not just a matter of visas and work permits. Heads of schools and principals like to hire licensed counselors. You'll be at a significant advantage if you can do so. While I am sure there are exceptions, I know of several situations where being unable to find a strong candidate with a license has had a school extend the search to another school year rather than hiring someone who they're not sure about.

If you are in South Korea there are many US accredited schools in the country. You might want to ask around to see if there's a licensed counselor at a school who would be willing to help. It's not unusual for counselors to get such requests and you may find someone who would be interested. Most supervisor roles for licensure do not require daily attention so it could work out.
dannydecha
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2020 4:33 pm

Re: Question about School Counselor Credentials

Post by dannydecha »

@Psyguy

Thank you for detailed answer. I've reached out to the university several times. The only option I have is to ask the licensing expert at the school. I had another US certified SC that was willing to fly in every month to supervise, but the school said the counselor would have to be an employee of the school I am doing my practicum at. I am frustrated, but I know that I am asking for a whole lot so it's okay.

I'm glad credential is possible through DCs OSSE. I will most likely complete my credentials this way!

My long term goal, would honestly be to stick with international schools and either continue working as a counselor or study a bit more and get licensed as a school psychologist (Or get trained for special ed). I love working as a counselor and working with students who were just like me (TCK). I don't think I will stray any time soon!

@Eion_padraig

I have a couple of schools/counselors that are willing to, but the program director has denied this. Here is the copy past response to my question from the director herself. "Yes, the supervisors that you are working with, must be on site, employed by the schools you will be doing your practicum at."

@interteach

hopefully, even though I finish the non-licensing route, I can get my credentials through DCs OSSE.

Thank you everyone for all the feedback (really quick as well! Wow!)
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@dannydecha

Would your IS consider employing a counselor as a consultant (for zero coin) to meet your Uni requirements? Have you looked into working part time, splitting your time, or volunteering at another IS with an appropriate counselor to do your practicum work to satisfy your Uni? Have you considered finding another IS all together that has a counselor who could supervise you? DC will get you a credential and it is renewable with PD, but you will be stuck with it, you wont be able to move it anywhere and will be forever hobbled because you didnt complete a practicum, and you cant really go back and do a practicum at a later time. You will also have the issue of having a general counseling degree as opposed to a school counseling degree, it may not be a problem now, but it may be in the future and short of doing another degree you wont be able to remedy it later. Its the difference between being a 'school counselor' and being a 'counselor who works with school age children'. I would exhaust any and all options before you settled on the DC route.
Your Uni is putting up a LOT of resistance to your obtaining a credential. Are you sure the state DOE where you are studying at Uni currently issues credentials to non-citizens?

Are you going to stay in SK? I ask because when you start getting into the top coin you can get in IE youre either at an elite IS that predominately caters to western students, in which you really dont fit the look they are looking for especially in Asia or your looking at the elite DSs in a given region and because those DSs are in the DE sphere your going to have increased difficulty with portability if you have to obtain a license to be eligible for those jobs.

You may wish to begin forming a study schedule for the ETS exam, it would be entirely reasonable to set aside 2 months of full time study before taking the exam.
You will also want to start planning your route for PD. You may want to explore either the MA temporary or initial credential as these would effectively be lifetime credentials. Pursuing the OSSE without a practicum may make you ineligible for the initial credential, but it doesnt matter (as long as you dont get the professional credential).
There is no mutual reciprocity for SCs in the UK and if you pursue the OSSE route (forgo the practicum) you will not be eligible for individual membership (prior to completing requirements for registered member) with a MH accreditor (BACP, British Association for Counseling & Psychotherapy, is the commonly accepted regulating body). Though these schemes require PD as well, typically 30/year.

You wont be "studying a little bit more" to be credentialed a a S.Psy. First, Uni programs (especially in the US) generally have a certain degree of detached disdain for one another. SC programs consider S.Psys to be - academics detached from the student and S.Psy programs consider SCs to be little more than touchy, feely, warm fuzzy (do you need a hug) distributors whose only real job is to manage the master schedule and know enough to refer and pass on the real problems to them (them being the professionals that matter). Second, you will not find a S.Psy program that is going to accept a majority of your courses towards a degree in S.Psy. At most (unless your current Uni has such a program and relationship) you might get a couple courses accepted, but you will still have the bulk of a whole degree to complete. Even with DC/OSSE there would be 9 new/differing courses youd have to complete as part of the new degree which, with the 500hr practicum (and no alternatives) would be an additional degree, not least of which they wont accept counseling towards a credential in S.Psy, and youll have to take another ETS exam (School Psychologist 5402).

Obtaining a SPED/SEN/LD would be difficult you would have to essentially complete an EPP/ITT program for DC (or anywhere). The MA requirements are pretty exhausting.
eion_padraig
Posts: 408
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm

Re: Question about School Counselor Credentials

Post by eion_padraig »

@dannydecha,

That's too bad that the program director isn't being flexible. There is a reason there is a shortage of credentialed school counselors. I had to navigate some issues similar to what you're dealing with but I was in the US so it was easier, so I was able to sort things out.

This is one of the reasons you can get good jobs without a credential in school counseling. If you end up not being able to get a credential, I think it would be important to note this in future job applications. While it won't matter at the places where it's a government requirement for a visa, at other places it could make a difference.

I hope you can get figure out a way to get the credential through an alternate route. Good luck.

Eion
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