Pet peeve of mine

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MusicTravel30
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri May 18, 2018 8:52 am

Pet peeve of mine

Post by MusicTravel30 »

This has not happened often, maybe three times. But my pet peeve is when HR or someone from the school messages you back after you send a resume saying something like "Thank you so much for the resume, we are interested, can you please respond to some questions (sometimes they ask you to make a sample lesson plan about ______.)

So you work hard, sometimes responding to 10 or more questions in-depth and put together a nice sample lesson plan only to never hear back from the employer. What gives?

Or you go deep into the recruitment process with a school, 3 interviews or more. Everything seems great. "Okay, you will be hearing from us shortly" or "I will recommend you to HR" after already having a great talk with HR, only to never hear back from them.

I get it, a school is under no obligation to respond to every person who sends a resume and they are busy. But, if you go deep into the interview process or jump through hoops to respond to a bunch of questions and/or make a sample lesson plan, the least they can do is take a minute to get back to you, in my opinion. To do the opposite is rude IMO, especially after 3+ interviews of 30 minutes +.

Just venting.

reisgio
Posts: 203
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by reisgio »

I actually love it when this happens because it puts the spotlight on what bastards the people running the school really are and demonstrates how lucky I am to have dodged the bullet of being offered a job (that I may have been foolish enough to accept) to work with them. This happens all the time and is illustrative of the dreck that have sadly ascended to high positions, not just in international schools, but also in many "respectable" organizations both domestically and internationally. Consider yourself blessed; you have someone looking out for you in high places!

sid
Posts: 1117
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:44 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by sid »

reisgio wrote:
> I actually love it when this happens because it puts the spotlight on what bastards
> the people running the school really are and demonstrates how lucky I am to have
> dodged the bullet of being offered a job (that I may have been foolish enough to
> accept) to work with them. This happens all the time and is illustrative of the
> dreck that have sadly ascended to high positions, not just in international schools,
> but also in many "respectable" organizations both domestically and internationally.
> Consider yourself blessed; you have someone looking out for you in high places!

Those grapes sound rather sour.

I absolutely agree that every applicant deserves a response, and the further one goes in the process, the more important and specific that response becomes. But it's rather a big stretch to say that the recruiter is a bastard and the school isn't respectable just because you didn't get a response.

I was recently shocked in one of our recruiting meetings. This exact topic had come up, and the general mood around the table was to reaffirm our commitment to responding to each and every applicant. But one of the team, who is generally a good egg, really pushed back. He absolutely didn't want to be held to this. "There are so many... it takes so much time... you mean EVERYONE who even sends an email even about a position that doesn't exist...." In the end he lost and was directed to toe the line. Will he? There isn't anyone to check up on that. I will be disappointed if he doesn't (though I'll likely never know), but I don't think our school should be written off completely. Surely we might have something to offer even if one of our recruiting team is a little beneath the mark in terms of courtesy.

PsyGuy
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Response

Post by PsyGuy »

I disagree with @Sid, not every applicant deserves a response, I agree with his resistance leadership. If someone didnt get to the interview step, and their just an applicant the standard disclaimer of "If you dont hear from us in X weeks, your application as unsuccessful". If youve gotten deep into the process, essentially the interview stage you do, but it doesnt needs to be very personalized.
1) No matter how polite and professional applicants are they always want to know why, and if you give them an answer and a breath they ill use that breath of time to say how they are better or they have what your looking for. Very few people, ITs included, handle rejection well.
2) Theres nothing to be gained by engaging with the rejected applicant longer, it doesnt serve anyone putting a name to a rejection, its much more in their interest to make the exchange as brief and unmemorable as possible.

reisgio
Posts: 203
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by reisgio »

@Sid, you make my point for me. I would not want to work within 100 yards of you.

I was clearly responding to the original poster who described scenarios in which the applicant jumped through many hoops already before the school's recruiters decide to go silent. That is the very definition of rude on the part of the school and if you can't call that bastardly behavior, something is clearly very wrong with you.

It's one thing to never respond to thousands of random applicants, but it's not an applicants fault when schools/recruiters are not capable of doing their job correctly and either they interview too many applicants or take too many applicants too deep into the process. That's a sign of incompetent leadership. When on top of that the recruiters can't even have the decency to say thank you to those they strung along, the recruiters are in my "good riddance to bad rubbish" category.

sid
Posts: 1117
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:44 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by sid »

reisgio wrote:
> @Sid, you make my point for me. I would not want to work within 100 yards of you.
>

I don’t recall inviting you.

If, though, by any chance, you were among the myriad of candidates whose applications I have received, you may rest assured that you have received a response from me.

We in fact seem to agree on most points, excluding the bastard status of some recruiters, but including that candidates deserve responses and that we shouldn’t work together.

Heliotrope
Posts: 686
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by Heliotrope »

reisgio wrote:
> @Sid, you make my point for me. I would not want to work within 100 yards
> of you.
>
> I was clearly responding to the original poster who described scenarios in
> which the applicant jumped through many hoops already before the school's
> recruiters decide to go silent. That is the very definition of rude on the
> part of the school and if you can't call that bastardly behavior, something
> is clearly very wrong with you.
>
> It's one thing to never respond to thousands of random applicants, but it's
> not an applicants fault when schools/recruiters are not capable of doing
> their job correctly and either they interview too many applicants or take
> too many applicants too deep into the process. That's a sign of incompetent
> leadership. When on top of that the recruiters can't even have the decency
> to say thank you to those they strung along, the recruiters are in my
> "good riddance to bad rubbish" category.

Did you actually read @Sid's response?
For example the "the general mood around the table was to reaffirm our commitment to responding to each and every applicant" bit?
'Each and everyone' would include those who have only bothered to send in the CV in response to a vacancy.
It sounds like he and the rest of leadership at his school are way more responsive than a very large majority of international schools. If that isn't good enough for you, good luck recruiting.

shawanda
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by shawanda »

Add to the peeves when a recruiter simply lies and say he/she has chosen to go in another direction and as a result selected another candidate for the position....and then a few days later the position is re-listed with a new application due date!

PsyGuy
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@shawanda

Whats the alternative, actually telling you sorry you were so unimpressive wed rather just keep looking from the beginning again. Hows that conversation helpful or beneficial, except to infuriate you, which isnt usually a good idea. You know what it means, they know what it means and if you cant say anything nice dont say anything at all, so they gave you the nice speech.

shawanda
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by shawanda »

PG,

Spare me. Honesty is always the best policy in a process like this. A joyous Christmas to you!

vandsmith
Posts: 338
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:16 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by vandsmith »

i think it works both ways. i would rather be told 'you're not what we're looking for, thanks for applying' than nothing at all. for a recruiter, it's 1 in what? a couple hundred? for an IT like myself, at the most it's 1 in 20 or 30. i remember schools who have contacted me, even if it was a generic 'we received your application' or 'we invite you to apply'. it goes without saying i respond to all schools who contact me regardless if i am interested in the position or not.

i know recruiters and heads don't have a lot of time and it runs on the business side of things. but, just like everyone tells ITs, the personal touch adds much more (at least in my eyes).

i think that you should get an email after a 1st interview and beyond.

i don't think it's all bastards in the recruiting area, i think it's much worse with bigger schools; i DO think the lamb has gotten rather fat however, and schools could absolutely do away with some of the fairs. it's good experience for some leadership, a . for others, and a necessary event for the rest. i don't envy them the job, but rather the off hours time they spend.

v.

fine dude
Posts: 505
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:12 pm

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by fine dude »

The main reason is how bad schools are at using technology for recruitment. If companies can automate and use creative tools to reach out, why can't schools do the same. It's ironic that folks with obsolete EdD's and PhD's who can't even use basic functions of Excel are at the helm. Worse, they don't even take the initiative to involve their tech department in the hiring process.

shadowjack
Posts: 1900
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am

Re: Pet peeve of mine

Post by shadowjack »

As a techie, it’s not my role to be involved in the hiring process, unless, as has happened in the past, I’m asked to evaluate a teacher with tech duties, a tech integrator, or a tech coordinator to see if he or she will fit with the team.

The person who might ask me for assistance is more likely the person tasked with HR, or the director. But honestly, most tech people in my experience already have too much on their plate to suggest and create more work for themselves. And before you tell me how easy and simple it is, I can tell you multiple stories of hours spent fixing things that were ‘simple and easy’ - sometimes more than once.

PsyGuy
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Location: Northern Europe

Comment

Post by PsyGuy »

Concur with @SJ

Heliotrope
Posts: 686
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Comment

Post by Heliotrope »

PsyGuy wrote:
> Concur with @SJ

I concur as well.

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