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Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby ChemEd » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:04 am

I am in the process of resigning from my current IS and looking at new positions that are becoming available. I am currently registered on ISS-Schrole and GRC. My colleague mentioned that my position has already been posted on Search (not a problem as I indicated that I was likely to leave and my school wants a jump start on applicants if I do resign). My question is, is there enough overlap in the recruitment agencies that I'll see most of the available positions or should I also register with Search? My field is IB chemistry if anyone thinks that matters.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby sid » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:49 am

DP Chem, or IB Chem? You might interview with a hardliner like me who pedantically insists that the IB starts with 3 year old students, whose idea of chemistry is discovering that mixing soap and water makes bubbles.
Anyway... I always double up. There is plenty of overlap among the agencies, but if your dream job is only listed with Search, you'll never even know that you missed your shot.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby interteach » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:54 am

I think it depends on the scope of your search. If you have a list of schools that aren't covered by ISS and GRC, you can regularly check those schools to see if they have vacancies and most-likely apply directly.

If you're looking to do the broadest possible search, you may want to sign up with Search - although that's what I might have done in the first place if I was looking to do a very wide search.

On the other hand (I realize I'm growing extra hands here) if you've already been a Search candidate and you have some excellent recommendations already on file that might be added along with some of your current ones, then it might make sense to sign up with them.
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Response

Postby PsyGuy » Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:36 am

The broader your job search the more benefit a premium recruiting agency can be and with a real broad search, if you ant to capture the most ISs and their relevant vacancies it wouldnt be unwise to register for both considering the barriers and cost are minimal.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby GrumblesMcGee » Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:24 am

If you want to maximize your chances of finding the best job (i.e. "FOMO"), sure, register with as many agencies as you can. There is a clear tradeoff (time, registration expense, fair attendance costs, burdening your references a little more) and diminishing returns (the number of jobs you're going to find on through a third agency is relatively low). As a previous comment mentioned, if you're looking at specific schools, you can typically stalk their web sites and apply directly.

Some folks here have noticed that I am no fan of Search, as I think the cost is too high and the service they provide is deceptively articulated at best. But if you're solely looking out for the maximum chance of landing the job you want, there's utility in being with them.

I am happy to see you're with GRC. I think they can make inroads and shake things up a bit if enough people support them.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby ChemEd » Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:28 pm

One bit I of information I have found out from my Head of School is about why certain schools may choose to recruit with ISS vs Search. Apparently, ISS now charges a flat fee to the school for how ever many candidates a school hires. Search charges for each individual hire. So it is only cost beneficial for a school to use ISS if they plan on hiring several of ISS's candidates. For schools that have low turnover it's more financially beneficial to use Search.
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Postby PsyGuy » Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:34 am

@ChemEd

Thats partially true and its relatively recent. What you are referring to was post the ISS and Schrole joint collaboration and venture. Schrole based their IS revenue on a membership scheme that ISs would pay one fee for membership and be entitled to unlimited recruiting. There is another segment of ISS though their traditional managed consultancy that still invoice based on percentage commission, as opposed to SAs fixed placement fee. ISS/Scrole also has two levels of membership for recruiters now premiere that includes fairs (ISS lite) and classic that doesnt include fairs (Schrole).
There are other factors and variables that effect recruiting dynamics between SA and ISS/Schrole.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby schoolofrock » Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:19 am

My search associate seems adamant that I cc him on any emails I send to schools outside of the Search website. I joined ISS and GRC. What is the protocol for applying/communicating with schools from within Search vs. ISS vs. GRC if a specific school is on all 3 platforms?
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Postby PsyGuy » Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:52 am

@schoolofrock

That depends what your risk aversion tolerance is? What level of adverse outcome are you willing to accept?

he number of service bureaus, job boards and agencies has grown and that means more competition in the agency space and reduced revenue opportunities. From the SA POV if your a registered candidate and the IS is repped by SA than any appointment or contract can be invoiced. That can and has been interpreted in the past in cases where the IS didnt even list the vacancy with SA. T Your associate wants to be in on the loop in case theres any chance they can invoice for a placement. SA doesnt make any coin off of you despite your registration fee. They make their coin off the placement fee from the IS. There is not an insignificant number of ISs that try to mitigate their recruiting costs by avoiding or reducing their invoice costs however they can, including using SA but structuring their appointments in such away as to avoid paying those placement fees. Thats what your associate is concerned about that youll take a position and the IS will ask you or suggest not informing your associate (keeping your profile open), they treat the appointment as an unfilled vacancy and then they dont have to pay the placement fee.

On one end of the spectrum your SA associate can decline to repp you in the future or even potentially drop you, though thats much harder to enforce since an associate is highly dependent on your cooperation and information, which doesnt usually surface until your firmly in an appointment and you notify your associate. Associates can only manage so many candidates and if you take up their time and a slot on their roster and they make nothing off you, if that becomes a pattern, they may decide your not worth the resources, time and energy in the future.
On the other end of the spectrum you owe them nothing and their greatest tool is self disclosure. If you dont copy them on application emails it will be much harder for them to track to the point that you can effectively keep your membership the full three years (possibly using it for a second round of recruiting past your initial appointment) without fees and costs.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby sid » Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:08 pm

Check the agreement you signed with Search. It does require you to copy your Search rep. Whether you consider your word as your bond...
What is the downside to copying in your rep? Mine is quite happy to counsel me through all my applications/candidacies regardless of which school. I find this helpful. Why turn away from an offered service?
Of my two go-rounds as a Search candidate, one resulted in a Search placement. The other didn’t. My rep was perfectly happy about both.
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Postby PsyGuy » Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:32 pm

@Sid

The contract is a piece of paper, whats it going to do give you a paper cut? Are you implying that SA would actually file suite in some court over failure to copy an email, there are no damages. All the contract language does is allow SA to drop their repp of an IT and shield them from the IT filing suite citing damages from lost work, etc.

There are two disadvantages although minor:
1) Youre slightly more expensive of a hire, and thus slightly less competitive. Since a direct hire doesnt have the placement fee.
2) There are leaders and ownership that will happily save coin and costs at any opportunity. If an IT copies their associate of an application, its much more difficult for the IS to justify a memo credit for the placement or frame the appoitment as nothing to do with SA, and thus no reason to pay a placement fee.

Not all associates are as helpful (nor would they necessarily be as happy with a non-SA placement) as yours have been. SA associates have gone after ITs for full placement fees when an IS has declined to pay a placement fee.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby sid » Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:31 am

PsyGuy wrote:
> @Sid
>
> The contract is a piece of paper, whats it going to do give you a paper cut? Are
> you implying that SA would actually file suite in some court over failure to copy
> an email, there are no damages.

I'm not, not even close. I went no further than suggesting that not everyone's word is their bond. (Mine is.) You, however, by introducing the possibility of civil action, do indeed seem to be implying it is a possibility.


> SA associates have gone after ITs for full
> placement fees when an IS has declined to pay a placement fee.

And that seems like total hooey. All of a sudden, the agreement you previously doubted could even give you a "papercut"... now this agreement will force teachers to pay what a school has defaulted on, despite lacking any language to that effect? I am happy that my worldview does not involve this level of conspiracy beliefs. It seems quite a dark world to live in.
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Postby PsyGuy » Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:53 am

@Sid

Your word is your bond, so Diogenes just hasnt found you yet or your on the ten honest man list but its not complete yet?
Many things are possible that are outside the probability of concern.

No, SA has gone after ITs directly not judicially. They send an email, stating you owe them for a placement fee, and if the IT doesnt pay the coin they will not repp them in the future. Usually SA offers a deal of 50% of the fee.

How would you know light without darkness?
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby schoolofrock » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:39 am

@sid - I don't have any issues with him being cc'd if I apply to something within Search but I feel like if I am applying to a job from a school that is on ISS or GRC and not on Search, I don't know why I would still need to cc him. I know my previous associate didn't ask me to reword emails to schools and over promote Search but this one has - twice this recruiting season. I just find it a little overbearing. Also, I know that Search is falling out of favor with some schools because of their high fees and I'm not sure why Search would deserve a cut if a school accesses my information only through ISS. I will keep my word but I feel that as the landscape of recruitment options change, this is something that shouldn't be set in stone.
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Re: Doubling up on Recruitment agencies

Postby sid » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:12 am

It is something the recruiting agencies are talking about addressing, but I haven't seen the action yet. Back in the day (I'm old, it appears), there were less agencies, no online databases (I was shocked and thrilled when they first offered a mailed CD-Rom with posted positions), and teachers generally worked with either ISS or Search, not both. Or just went it alone. Obviously the model has changed, and the practices haven't fully caught up. They will. (Apparently I'm old enough to have seen that everything generally gets taken care of, one way or another.) As for who gets paid when you get hired, leave that to the agencies/school to sort it out. Not your problem.
Every time your Associate is looped in on communication between you and a school, they learn more about you, your hopes, style, non-negotiables. That makes them a better rep for you. They also learn more about the school, even if (especially if) it's not a Search school, making them a better rep for everyone.
As for rewording and promoting Search, that does sound odd. Ignore that? He can't make you. The papercut agreement doesn't go that far.
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