When do schools begin hiring?

[PsyGuy]

@indogal

It was, you dont have to be a member of one of those ISs anymore to join GRC. It was really small though at its inception.
Only a small number of the ISs are top tier ISs, those ISs are basically shills to to attract candidates. The GRC isnt an early "in" to any of those top tier ISs.
They have two fairs, one in Dubai and one in BKK both in November, what your going to find is all those other lower tier ISs being the ones eager to recruit.
Their model is a strong sell, no registration fees for candidates nor placement fees for ISs, the problem has been that premium agencies (mainly SA) consider any placement of one of their candidates regardless of how or where it happens as invoiceable, which has caused some problems.
Its not difficult, they accept ISs that are established regardless of tier.

[Heliotrope]

PsyGuy wrote:
> @Heliotrope
>
> No they dont. They dont have the elite tier IS in HK, Switzerland, Germany,
> etc. We dont share lists of elite tier ISs. Regardless, those ISs are as I
> described before, Shills.

They definitely have one of the top schools in both HK and Switzerland.
In Germany, they have one of what most consider the top 3, although personally I've heard stories that would disqualify it from that top 3.
You might have a different list than what most people consider tier 1.
Their list would be impressive to most ITs who do their research.

If you read my post you'll see I'm not saying these ISs use it to recruit a lot (or at all), I'm actually doubting that, so whether or not they are all 'shills' is for someone else to comment on.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

They absolutely do not. Youre top may be bigger than the actual top.

[Heliotrope]

PsyGuy wrote:
> They absolutely do not. Youre top may be bigger than the actual top.

'Actual top'? There is no 'actual top'. It's all subjective because not everyone looks for the same in a school, and different ITs prioritise different things.
My list of tier 1 schools is based on what a large number of ITs have repeatedly mentioned as being top tier. I then published that list on the paid forum, for everyone to critique and amend.
I've never seen your list of top tier schools. Feel free to post a link to it if it exists.

Are you seriously saying HKIS is not a top school?

Even if you do, what about the 2 best schools in Japan, the 2 best schools in Thailand, the best school in Taiwan, the 4 best schools in China, the 2 best schools in Vietnam, the best school in South Korea? Are you disputing those as well?

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

There is an actual top.
You can look for something else in an IS and an elite tier IS may not have that for you, but its still an elite tier IS. You might find everything you ant in a third tier IS, but its still a third tier IS.
The top is a lot like being underwater, the top is the point at which water meets air, anything below that and you better have gills because your breathing water.
Im saying its not the top.
Ive seen your list, we disagree.

You throw top and best around a lot. You do know that there cant be two best of anything right, that of any quantity more than one, one has to be better than another to be best.

[Heliotrope]

There is no actual top, because (as you once said:) there is no official list of tiers, and there are no official criteria for a school that makes it tier 1 or 2 or 3 when met. What we do have is sort of a consensus amongst the majority of a group of ITs that some schools should be considered tier 1, based on what most ITs feel an IS should offer. That consensus is what I based my list on, although I'm sure there are a few omissions and a few schools on it that might not belong.

You've seen my list, please show me yours if you'd be so kind.

There's nothing wrong with saying 'the best 4 schools in China'. It describes the top 4. Happy to clarify.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

Yes, there is an actual top.
I never claimed there is no official list of tiers.
There are formal criteria for tier status.
We do not share the same consensus.
Ranking discussions of ISs are not permitted in the public forum.
Yes there is, best means to excel above all others.

[Heliotrope]

PsyGuy wrote:
> @Heliotrope
>
> Yes, there is an actual top.

Great, where can I find it?


> I never claimed there is no official list of tiers.

Yes you did, but I'll let that one go since it's impossible to find that quote without spending many hours.


> There are formal criteria for tier status.

Great. What are they, and who established them?


> Yes there is, best means to excel above all others.

Yes, the '4 best' means the four top schools that excel above all the others.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

Providing tier ranking of ISs is not permitted on the public forum.
I never claimed there is no official list of tiers.
Ive posted the discussion of tier assessment a number of times.
You do not know what "all" means, it means to the exclusion of all but one.

[Heliotrope]

PsyGuy wrote:
> Providing tier ranking of ISs is not permitted on the public forum.

That's why I'm not asking you to post it here, but simply to tell me where to find it. You're allowed to post links.


> I never claimed there is no official list of tiers.

Yes, you did. Since I don't want to spend hours looking for that quote, I'll let it go.
But tell me then, who compiled it?
And why doesn't anybody ever mention it when people are discussing which schools they think are tier 1/2/3?


> Ive posted the discussion of tier assessment a number of times.

Your opinion alone, or a consensus reached on this forum (and there was hardly a consensus) doesn't make it formal criteria.
There's nothing official about it. That's why I've never claimed my list, which was based on what I could find to be the consensus on what are tier 1 schools, is official.


> You do not know what "all" means, it means to the exclusion of
> all but one.

I don't know what "all" means? All means all.
'The best' means the school that's better than the rest.
The '2 best' means the two schools that are better than the rest.
If you read, well, basically anything, you'll find that 'the best' is often followed by a plural (restaurants, movies, schools), and there's nothing incorrect about that.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

Providing tier ranking of ISs is not permitted on the public forum.
No I didnt. I never claimed "there is no official list of tiers".
Ive posted the discussion of tier assessment a number of times. I didnt claim it was official, I stated it was formal.
You do not know what best means.

[Heliotrope]

Ah, repeating yourself.
I could copy-paste my reactions again to your points, but you can find them in my previous post should you care to react to them.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

They were right the first time, why wouldnt I repeat them.

[Heliotrope]

Well, I addressed your remarks point by point, but you seem unwilling to respond to that.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

I take your question.