Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@Illiane_Blues

Yes that is a valid argument, its not invalid because you say so. Its still absolutely a victimless crime, your friend choose this business if they dont want to give tours dont give tours to anyone, no one held your friend under duress and forced them to give a tour. I dont have to subscribe to the @Illiane_Blues standard of human value because you say so.
Heliotrope
Posts: 1167
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Reply

Post by Heliotrope »

No, it's costing her money, she's a victim.
She chose to give tours to prospective buyers, not to liars that just want to see the house because a celebrity lives there.
Illiane_Blues

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Illiane_Blues »

Indeed @Heliotrope.
And again, it wouldn't be 'cost of doing business' if people wouldn't lie, so that's not an argument here, since we're talking about whether lying to get a tour of a house is ok.
It's like saying to a police officer who gets shot on the job that he shouldn't blame the shooter, because it's part of being a cop, when talking about whether it's ok to shoot someone.
Heliotrope
Posts: 1167
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Heliotrope »

It might be a controversial position, but I think shooting someone is not ok.

There are situations where lying or shooting someone can be justified, in cases of life and death mostly. If a drunk man with a knife is chasing a girl and he asked me if she went left or right, I would point him in the wrong direction. But lying to get a tour is not exactly a life or death situation.
Illiane_Blues

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Illiane_Blues »

VERY controversial!

Hey, maybe the girl just lost her knife, and the guy is trying to return it to her?
No, of course sometimes lying can be ok if prevents something terrible. And of course that doesn't apply to getting a tour.
sid
Posts: 1392
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:44 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by sid »

“They keep on committing antisocial acts as if they are immune to the dictates of law and order - as if they are living in a society where human decency no longer exists”
- Talking with Psychopaths and Savages, Christopher Berry-Dee
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Discussion

Post by PsyGuy »

@Heliotrope
@Illiane_Blues

No shes not a victim, shes not under duress no one is making her give tours, shes choosing to give tours, she could simply determine not to show these homes at all, thats a business decision of hers. She could institute policies and procedures to screen candidates for tours before giving them access, these are all business decisions she has chosen to do, and thus is a cost of doing business.

Deception to get a tour of a house is absolutely okay, it fulfills the wants and needs of the one seeking the tour.

No its like blaming a shark for biting a human in the ocean, they choose to go in the water. This family member choose to give tours of celeb homes.

Is the girl being chased attractive, is she single, does she appear affluent, is there any indication that there would be something in it for me? Talking to a drunk person with a knife who is fully committed to chasing someone down even if its just hello can get you crazy murdered, if this person was approaching me to even ask something Id be running away, there wouldnt be a conversation. Sure she could have just dropped her knife and he could be trying to catch her to return it, but again whats in it for me to get involved in this scenario. Absent some sort of incentive to get involved if it comes between me and an asset, send flowers.

@Sid

Keep us updated on that Diogenes award.
Illiane_Blues

Re: Discussion

Post by Illiane_Blues »

Yes, it fulfils their wants & needs, but that doesn't mean they're entitled to it. Some wants & needs are best kept in check.
And she has NOT chosen to give tours to liars, only to truly interested potential buyers. Problem is that liars will say they're interested, you can't screen against that unless you have a lie detector. And people won't willingly give you their bank statements you know, also not the ones who can afford these places. And plenty of people who would pass a credit screening might still just be fans wanting to see a private home of a celebrity.
She IS a victim of these liars, since if they wouldn't lie, they wouldn't cost her money. It's not rocket science.
And even if I forget to lock my front door, that wouldn't give you the right steal my TV, only the opportunity, and you would still be arrested for it.

And WHY are you asking if she's attractive? What kind of question is that even??
Will you only save the lives of attractive females? Wow!
And you should read more carefully, @Heliotrope wrote: "... and he asked me if she went left or right", so there's no option of not getting involved in this hypothetical anyway.
Thames Pirate
Posts: 1150
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Thames Pirate »

Don't bother. Adding some sexism is just another way to get you to engage. Best to leave him to his advocacy of fraud (common theme--ghosting jobs, lying on applications, etc.) and let people draw their own conclusions. Those with similar tendencies would not need his advice to encourage lying, while those who are fundamentally ethical would ignore it anyway. Those who wonder if a little white lie matters would have found their answers by now given that the admin on the board as well as numerous teachers have argued against the lie for practical as well as ethical reasons.

Psyguy is a known fraud on the forum. Best to let him expose himself, then let him be.
Illiane_Blues

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Illiane_Blues »

@Thames Pirate

You're right.
The sexism shouldn't really surprise me after all the dishonesty.
I will try to refrain from engaging further.
I know you shouldn't feed a troll, but it's hard to resist sometimes, especially when his logic is so flawed.
But I won't respond to this thread any longer at least.
Thames Pirate
Posts: 1150
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Thames Pirate »

If you're going to feed him, do it for the entertainment value and let him expose himself more. Don't try using logic.

This is a person who informed me I was wrong about how much I saved, claimed to be a stealth recruiter at a hotel he never visited, claims to know horses, and pretends that being able to read German law does not give one a better understanding of the law than he claims to have. He claims to have been a junior admin in Denmark, have DODEA experience, and has made any number of claims in threads I haven't seen or claims I have forgotten that everyone knows are fake. Someone so pathological is not really not that concerned with logic.

Feel free to enjoy the popcorn and chime in for giggles, though.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@Illiane_Blues

Yes it does, your entitled to the pursuit of happiness.

Yes, she has chosen to give tours to liars or shed find a better way of identifying liars and decline to give them tours. You can screen against that outside of a polygraph. You can explore varying factors to determine if they are really in the market for a new home and have the financial resources to afford the home purchase, its called "qualifying" a client. If they dont disclose the financial information they dont get a tour, those are all business choices she made.

Shes not a VICTIM she did nothing under duress and wasnt forced to give anyone a tour, she doesnt have to give a tour to ANYONE. They arent costing her money they are costing her time, its her paradigm that converts time to coin.

Stealing your television is a crime, lying to obtain a tour of a celebrity home isnt a crime.

The kind of question that aids my decision making process.
I didnt claim Id save attractive females.
Thats a false dichotomy fallacy, theres always an option, real life isnt A or B.

@Thames Pirate

Youre wrong about how much you saved, I cant reconcile your experience with mine.
Have absolutely been a recruiter and did stealth recruiting.
Never claimed to know much about horses, just more than you.
Was a junior admin in Denmark.
Do work for DODEA.
Heliotrope
Posts: 1167
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Heliotrope »

@PsyGuy
As Illiane_Blues said, your logic is flawed.
There are limits to your right to the pursuit of happiness. If all citizens assert this right to the fullest, one's pursuit will impede another's. Her sister in law is entitled to not having to tour these people.
Furthermore, it is a crime if you're misrepresenting yourself to gain access to someone's private home.
And earlier in the thread she said the extra tours have forced her to hire an assistant, so it's costing her actual money. But regardless, time is indeed money, as it's her job, and you need time to do a job and earn an income.
You said "Is the girl being chased attractive, is she single, does she appear affluent, is there any indication that there would be something in it for me?", so yes, you're saying that her being attractive would influence your decision to help her or not.

I'm pretty sure Thames Pirate knows far better than you how much exactly she saved.
That you can't reconcile her experience with yours just means that you earn less, spend more, or both. I doesn't invalidates her experience. I know plenty of teachers who have no problem saving serious coin in Europe.
Heliotrope
Posts: 1167
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:48 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Heliotrope »

Maybe I'll stop engaging as well. There's not much harm in letting further replies go unanswered I guess.

I almost forgot I was the one who started this thread.
I'll email the school asking for a tour (as a teacher of course) a bit closer to the Summer and see what happens.
Thames Pirate
Posts: 1150
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am

Re: Visiting a school during the Summer for a tour?

Post by Thames Pirate »

Heliotrope wrote:

> I almost forgot I was the one who started this thread.
> I'll email the school asking for a tour (as a teacher of course) a bit
> closer to the Summer and see what happens.

Good luck!

Psy, good luck to you as well in getting anyone to believe a single one of your lies. Oh, wait. That requires evidence.
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