Newbie here. ..I’ve been offered a position in an intriguing city in China with a fantastic salary package. My only concern is that 95% of the school population is made up of local Chinese students. My 10 & 12 year old will be part of that small 5%. I was hoping for a school with a more international population but this position is too interesting to not give it strong consideration. Although the kids are flexible, adventurous and accepting, I’m worried this could be a too challenging. They have never lived abroad. Have any of you parents been in a similar situation? How did your kids handle it? Teachers- from your perspective, how does this play out in your classroom? Of course, all kids handle things differently, but I’d love to hear any and all perspectives.
p.s. This forum has been wonderful for a new IT beginning the adventure of a lifetime. Thank you for all the solid advice!
How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% North A
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Lmartin106
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wrldtrvlr123
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Experiences will vary wildly obviously. If it was in the ME I would advise giving it a pass as there are many horror stories out there about bullying, western kids being isolated, harassment, etc.
The same type problems can happen anywhere but may be somewhat less likely in China. It often seems that the older the children the more significant the issues can be with teenagers getting some of the roughest treatment. Again, in China, this may not be as true. My personal experience in China as a parent and teacher is in schools with a little more balance and the problems seemed to be fairly minor with most students seeming to find their group of friends, Chinese and Western. And, for good or bad, Westerners can be seen a little more positively in China than in the ME (to risk an over-generalization).
So, I would not rule it out but try and do a little more research. Can you talk to any current teachers, preferably someone with children at the school?
The same type problems can happen anywhere but may be somewhat less likely in China. It often seems that the older the children the more significant the issues can be with teenagers getting some of the roughest treatment. Again, in China, this may not be as true. My personal experience in China as a parent and teacher is in schools with a little more balance and the problems seemed to be fairly minor with most students seeming to find their group of friends, Chinese and Western. And, for good or bad, Westerners can be seen a little more positively in China than in the ME (to risk an over-generalization).
So, I would not rule it out but try and do a little more research. Can you talk to any current teachers, preferably someone with children at the school?
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Do they speak Chinese?
Response
Understand its likely that 5% is an exaggeration. Its probably smaller than that, and what that 5% is is likely ITs kids only.
So much "depends". Whats the size of the city, will there be outside opportunities for socialization and is the city population more metro/cosmo? If its a small city and not much of a western presence, your childs only friends might be the couple other western ITs kids. If its not very cosmo/metro than there isnt likely to be a lot of English and I doubt your child knows any Mandarin meaning it could be very reclusive for them. Normally having a western friend would be a status bump for other students especially at that tween age range, but the novelty is going to wear off quickly due to the communication barrier. if however theres a healthy expat population than your child can socialize outside of the IS, its less of an issue.
I would agree with @WT123 that teenagers get it the hardest especially at older ages (around 16), your kids arent there yet, but as they move into senior school its going to get harder. If its just two years your 10 year old will probably be okay, your 12 year old will be moving through some awkward periods. Asian cultures tend to focus almost exclusively on school and education, "balance" isnt a priority, thus most children make all their friends in primary and thats their social circle well into their Uni period.
My experience is that the new ITs kids are a novelty and everyone seems friendly at first, but kids either make a besty really fast as that interest evaporates really quickly. The challenge of these are my friends since primary and we can all speak to each other in the local language becomes too hard too overcome when the local kids exhaust their English. Boys tend to last a little longer in life because video games are more culturally transient, but F2F girls activities can get outright hostile. Everyone will be nice and polite especially to a ITs kids, but you realize its mostly superficial, and your child just isnt invited to socialize.
So much "depends". Whats the size of the city, will there be outside opportunities for socialization and is the city population more metro/cosmo? If its a small city and not much of a western presence, your childs only friends might be the couple other western ITs kids. If its not very cosmo/metro than there isnt likely to be a lot of English and I doubt your child knows any Mandarin meaning it could be very reclusive for them. Normally having a western friend would be a status bump for other students especially at that tween age range, but the novelty is going to wear off quickly due to the communication barrier. if however theres a healthy expat population than your child can socialize outside of the IS, its less of an issue.
I would agree with @WT123 that teenagers get it the hardest especially at older ages (around 16), your kids arent there yet, but as they move into senior school its going to get harder. If its just two years your 10 year old will probably be okay, your 12 year old will be moving through some awkward periods. Asian cultures tend to focus almost exclusively on school and education, "balance" isnt a priority, thus most children make all their friends in primary and thats their social circle well into their Uni period.
My experience is that the new ITs kids are a novelty and everyone seems friendly at first, but kids either make a besty really fast as that interest evaporates really quickly. The challenge of these are my friends since primary and we can all speak to each other in the local language becomes too hard too overcome when the local kids exhaust their English. Boys tend to last a little longer in life because video games are more culturally transient, but F2F girls activities can get outright hostile. Everyone will be nice and polite especially to a ITs kids, but you realize its mostly superficial, and your child just isnt invited to socialize.
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Here is a good ISR article that may be of some help in making your deision
https://internationalschoolsreviewdiscu ... t4parents/
https://internationalschoolsreviewdiscu ... t4parents/
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eion_padraig
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
I've lived in China for quite a while. It's unlikely that they'd experience any type of physical bullying even if they're boys. The bigger risk is that they may feel socially isolated. In my experience, girls tend to have bigger issues that boys. Part of that is there is sports culture for Chinese boys (basketball, soccer), which is not totally absent among Chinese girls, but it's far less developed.
Although, obesity is on the rise in China, I've found Western girls are more likely to have body image issues arise too.
The social norms are very different from Western countries to China, so your kids will have to be wiling to put themselves out there socially. Honestly, in the schools I've worked out the Western kids tend to hang out with the ethnically Chinese kids who have lived in Western countries too. They share a lot more in common.
It's not so different from what I see with teachers. Most often the foreign teachers hang out with each other rather than with local Chinese teachers. While some friendships arise with Chinese teachers, they're much more casual. I get along with the Chinese staff, and I speak Mandarin pretty well, but we don't frequently go out to dinner or have drinks. We might socialize at a school . for the whole school.
Have you asked your kids directly about how they feel about it? If they seem excited about it that would be a good sign.
If the city has a decent foreign population, that could make things easier if you'll be living somewhere they can make friends out of school too. Do you mind sharing what city? That could give more context.
Eion
Although, obesity is on the rise in China, I've found Western girls are more likely to have body image issues arise too.
The social norms are very different from Western countries to China, so your kids will have to be wiling to put themselves out there socially. Honestly, in the schools I've worked out the Western kids tend to hang out with the ethnically Chinese kids who have lived in Western countries too. They share a lot more in common.
It's not so different from what I see with teachers. Most often the foreign teachers hang out with each other rather than with local Chinese teachers. While some friendships arise with Chinese teachers, they're much more casual. I get along with the Chinese staff, and I speak Mandarin pretty well, but we don't frequently go out to dinner or have drinks. We might socialize at a school . for the whole school.
Have you asked your kids directly about how they feel about it? If they seem excited about it that would be a good sign.
If the city has a decent foreign population, that could make things easier if you'll be living somewhere they can make friends out of school too. Do you mind sharing what city? That could give more context.
Eion
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Lmartin106
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
The city is Shenzhen so there are hopefully many opportunities outside of school for them to socialize with English speakers. We’ve asked them how they feel about it. My 12 year old son is all for it. My 10 year old daughter is not quite as excited. This is a tough choice but the advice we’ve received has been helpful.
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wrldtrvlr123
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Try posting the question on the TES Overseas Teachers forum. There are some regular posters who currently teach in Shenzhen.
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
As a father who has lived through this, all I can advise is think long and hard. If you decide to take the opportunity realize it will be as hard, if not harder on you.
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Don't put your kids in that situation.
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
THEY WILL LEARN TO SPEAK PERFECT CHINESE.
They are kids, they will adapt to anything. Now be a PARENT and make the decision you KNOW deep in your heart is the best one for your family: take the job.
They are kids, they will adapt to anything. Now be a PARENT and make the decision you KNOW deep in your heart is the best one for your family: take the job.
Reply
@Lmartin106
Shenzhen is pretty cosmo/metro but its not going to be Shanghai. The pboblem is going to be finding other activities, not because they arent there but because the expat culture in Shenzhen is more organized around pockets of expats that are insulated from one another. They just dont intermingle as much.
Girls have a harder time than boys and body image for girls can be an issue, not so much at 10 but you will be getting to that age group for your daughter where physical appearance becomes much more important. If your son is into sports and video game culture at 12 he wont have as hard a time socializing. Much of this will depend on what your daughters outside interests are, or what she might possibly be interested in. The clubs and associations available for girls arent as well developed (its mostly centered around fine and performing arts, such as dance and music, etc.)
Its going to be hard for your daughter as shes exiting primary and moving into lower secondary/junior school without a social circle, really hard. Its going to depend what expat/western ITs kids she can identify and socialize with and what opportunities she does outside of the IS. If shes really into some kind of activity and throws her everything into it she can probably continue doing so independently. If the entirety of her social experience is going to depend on being friends with the one other daughter of another ITs, that scenario would be scary.
In Shenzhen your not likely to find many local kids that have spent time in the west, its going to be a very small group if any.
I disagree with @eion_padraig in what ITs do. Single IT guys tend to socialize equally between western and local populations. Single IT woman tend to socialize more with other ITs. Couples tend to socialize with other couples that are predominately western.
@senator
They will NOT learn PERFECT Chinese (and by that I assume you are referring to Mandarin). VERY few people master the full 50K+ character text.
Shenzhen is pretty cosmo/metro but its not going to be Shanghai. The pboblem is going to be finding other activities, not because they arent there but because the expat culture in Shenzhen is more organized around pockets of expats that are insulated from one another. They just dont intermingle as much.
Girls have a harder time than boys and body image for girls can be an issue, not so much at 10 but you will be getting to that age group for your daughter where physical appearance becomes much more important. If your son is into sports and video game culture at 12 he wont have as hard a time socializing. Much of this will depend on what your daughters outside interests are, or what she might possibly be interested in. The clubs and associations available for girls arent as well developed (its mostly centered around fine and performing arts, such as dance and music, etc.)
Its going to be hard for your daughter as shes exiting primary and moving into lower secondary/junior school without a social circle, really hard. Its going to depend what expat/western ITs kids she can identify and socialize with and what opportunities she does outside of the IS. If shes really into some kind of activity and throws her everything into it she can probably continue doing so independently. If the entirety of her social experience is going to depend on being friends with the one other daughter of another ITs, that scenario would be scary.
In Shenzhen your not likely to find many local kids that have spent time in the west, its going to be a very small group if any.
I disagree with @eion_padraig in what ITs do. Single IT guys tend to socialize equally between western and local populations. Single IT woman tend to socialize more with other ITs. Couples tend to socialize with other couples that are predominately western.
@senator
They will NOT learn PERFECT Chinese (and by that I assume you are referring to Mandarin). VERY few people master the full 50K+ character text.
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eion_padraig
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Shenzhen is a big city and spread out. A lot depends on where you live. Shekou is where Shekou International School, QSI Shenzhen and other IS are located. There are lots of expats living there with kids. It's fairly pricey living in that area and it may or may not be convenient to where you'll be working and having your kids go to school.
Other areas of the city may be very local or have expats that don't have kids. Besides Shekou, I don't know where the centers of expats are who have kids. Maybe someone else can weigh in.
If your kids are into sports, you might look for youth leagues. If you're religious, you might also connect with people through churches.
Eion
Other areas of the city may be very local or have expats that don't have kids. Besides Shekou, I don't know where the centers of expats are who have kids. Maybe someone else can weigh in.
If your kids are into sports, you might look for youth leagues. If you're religious, you might also connect with people through churches.
Eion
Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Lmartin106,
Is the school the Basis school?
Is the school the Basis school?
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Lmartin106
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Re: How do your kids/students adjust with a 95% local/5% Nor
Yes, it’s basis.