When is everyone getting to London? Want to have a candidate soirée? I am ready to rock this mf out!
Also, do schools usually go into MIA mode now through the end of the year? And if that's the case, does that mean that with only one week to go before the fair when they get back from break that they will be less likely to want to do video sessions the week before the fair, as they are probably going one way or the other and may as well wait until the fair? As always, thoughts and insights much appreciated.
London Here I Come
Response
If your going to do that before the fair starts pick an out of the way location to meet, a number of recruiters and leadership head out for a pint and you dont want them seeing you.
For the most part yes, many recruiters and leadership focus on the holidays at this point, unless the IS has to recruit a mid year hire and they havent gotten much advance notice.
Not at all a lot of recruiters especially at third tier ISs will attempt to get out in front of other recruiters and the week before the start of the fair is when many ISs are arranging their first night recruiting candidates and their preference candidates. The week before is when a lot of actual invite slots get filled.
Time is just too precious a commodity to a recruiter who has to do any sizeable amount of recruiting, the ISs that have only a couple vacancies are more likely to wait, but there is never enough time to do everything a recruiter wants and getting advance offers or interviews done with and over frees up very valuable time at the fair. The issue is that everyone wants the best deal and many IT candidates will insist on some amount of time to consider an offer. You are supposed to get 24 hours, but for many ISs thats just unrealistic, you may get no time (you have to decide now) or you may get a few hours to end of the day, too at the latest next morning (and thats uncommon). They need to make their time pay and if you haven't said yes, they need to keep interviewing, because they cant lose the time. If you say yes and accept they can cross that vacancy off the list, cancel the other interviews and move on to the next vacancy and contact other candidates on their wait list to fill those slots freed up. So what a recruiter does is have a preference list of their first choice preference which they meet with on the first night before setup. For some candidates its just a formality a meet and greet shake hands, for others it really is an interview, but this is why the morning of signup is always so depressing as a number of ISs will have filled vacancies before signup even happens and some ISs will have filled all their vacancies.
Many ISs know they cant compete well with a full room of other ISs, and a lot of ITs would rather avoid the stress and cost of attending the fair so they use the same mechanism of interviews and offers the week before the fair, because they want to capitalize on that stress before you have an opportunity to determine your marketability, and they do it because it works. Many ITs are uncomfortable with the aggressiveness and competition of competing for a job and suddenly the pitch from an IS that appears to have gone out of their way is very flattering and they feel special in that the IS appears to really want them, making the location and its comp seem less like a hardship.
For the most part yes, many recruiters and leadership focus on the holidays at this point, unless the IS has to recruit a mid year hire and they havent gotten much advance notice.
Not at all a lot of recruiters especially at third tier ISs will attempt to get out in front of other recruiters and the week before the start of the fair is when many ISs are arranging their first night recruiting candidates and their preference candidates. The week before is when a lot of actual invite slots get filled.
Time is just too precious a commodity to a recruiter who has to do any sizeable amount of recruiting, the ISs that have only a couple vacancies are more likely to wait, but there is never enough time to do everything a recruiter wants and getting advance offers or interviews done with and over frees up very valuable time at the fair. The issue is that everyone wants the best deal and many IT candidates will insist on some amount of time to consider an offer. You are supposed to get 24 hours, but for many ISs thats just unrealistic, you may get no time (you have to decide now) or you may get a few hours to end of the day, too at the latest next morning (and thats uncommon). They need to make their time pay and if you haven't said yes, they need to keep interviewing, because they cant lose the time. If you say yes and accept they can cross that vacancy off the list, cancel the other interviews and move on to the next vacancy and contact other candidates on their wait list to fill those slots freed up. So what a recruiter does is have a preference list of their first choice preference which they meet with on the first night before setup. For some candidates its just a formality a meet and greet shake hands, for others it really is an interview, but this is why the morning of signup is always so depressing as a number of ISs will have filled vacancies before signup even happens and some ISs will have filled all their vacancies.
Many ISs know they cant compete well with a full room of other ISs, and a lot of ITs would rather avoid the stress and cost of attending the fair so they use the same mechanism of interviews and offers the week before the fair, because they want to capitalize on that stress before you have an opportunity to determine your marketability, and they do it because it works. Many ITs are uncomfortable with the aggressiveness and competition of competing for a job and suddenly the pitch from an IS that appears to have gone out of their way is very flattering and they feel special in that the IS appears to really want them, making the location and its comp seem less like a hardship.
Re: London Here I Come
I've still heard nothing from no one. I am hoping someone comes calling some time the week of Jan 2 or Jan 9.
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Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: London Here I Come
We received three interview requests a few days before the fair, including our dream school. Schools will often see what they fill at other fairs. Also, they wait until after Christmas. We visited our HR department on Wednesday (we dogsit for one of them and have become good friends). They were in the process of looking over the applications and trying to narrow down the 100s to a shortlist before the fair.
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helloiswill
- Posts: 75
- Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:39 am
Re: London Here I Come
Thanks Thames! I always enjoy hearing about the hiring process from the perspective of the school recruitment team.
One more question as I prepare...
One more question: If I am at a US school now and it's a good one, but one that I would leave for the right international school, how do you recommend I handle listing a reference (or ideally not) from this school on a reference sheet at the fair? I understand that international schools like references to be available to speak to them quickly if an offer is forthcoming at a fair, but I don't want anyone at this school to know I am considering leaving until I am certainly leaving. It's a school that has one year contracts and I will stay if I need to, but don't want them to be alerted to my hope to leave if an international school contacts them with a reference check during the fair. I have other great references from previous schools/employers on Search and on my applications. Will international schools understand my reluctance to share a reference from my current school? It's not a school with a lot of turnover so them getting tipped off to my potential decision to leave would not serve me well internally at the school.
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Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: London Here I Come
If it were me (and this is just my limited experience talking), I would only mention the reference after you have an offer and if you know your references will check out--and even then, only if they insist. Unless all your other references are really dated (or you have very few), I would just leave them as they are. I would, however, mention your reasoning if it arises (if they ask), if your references are dated, and only after an offer. If they insist but you are committed, then you can provide a reference from your current school after the offer.
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wrldtrvlr123
- Posts: 1173
- Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:59 am
- Location: Japan
Re: London Here I Come
shawanda wrote:
> One more question: If I am at a US school now and it's a good one, but one that I
> would leave for the right international school, how do you recommend I handle listing
> a reference (or ideally not) from this school on a reference sheet at the fair?
> I understand that international schools like references to be available to speak
> to them quickly if an offer is forthcoming at a fair, but I don't want anyone at
> this school to know I am considering leaving until I am certainly leaving. It's
> a school that has one year contracts and I will stay if I need to, but don't want
> them to be alerted to my hope to leave if an international school contacts them
> with a reference check during the fair. I have other great references from previous
> schools/employers on Search and on my applications. Will international schools
> understand my reluctance to share a reference from my current school? It's not a
> school with a lot of turnover so them getting tipped off to my potential decision
> to leave would not serve me well internally at the school.
====================
Is this not a Search fair? I am surprised that you ever able to register with Search without references from from your current admin as our associates have always been quite - about that (and wanting TWO current references to reactivate our files).
My experience (also limited)/opinion is different regarding letting your current school know about your overseas dreams. What seems to work for many people is mentioning that you dream of teaching overseas and that you are going to a job fair but it's extremely unlikely you would be offered anything at one of your dream schools/locations. It's usually an exotic/special enough situation that the current administrators don't generally hold it against you for looking but then are also not blindsided when they get a call for a reference. And we know how much administrator and bosses of any kind "love" surprises/being blind sided.
If you really think that your int'l job searching will hurt you at your current school then I guess hold it back but many (although certainly not all) of the good to better schools will want to check with your current administrator BEFORE actually offering you a job.
> One more question: If I am at a US school now and it's a good one, but one that I
> would leave for the right international school, how do you recommend I handle listing
> a reference (or ideally not) from this school on a reference sheet at the fair?
> I understand that international schools like references to be available to speak
> to them quickly if an offer is forthcoming at a fair, but I don't want anyone at
> this school to know I am considering leaving until I am certainly leaving. It's
> a school that has one year contracts and I will stay if I need to, but don't want
> them to be alerted to my hope to leave if an international school contacts them
> with a reference check during the fair. I have other great references from previous
> schools/employers on Search and on my applications. Will international schools
> understand my reluctance to share a reference from my current school? It's not a
> school with a lot of turnover so them getting tipped off to my potential decision
> to leave would not serve me well internally at the school.
====================
Is this not a Search fair? I am surprised that you ever able to register with Search without references from from your current admin as our associates have always been quite - about that (and wanting TWO current references to reactivate our files).
My experience (also limited)/opinion is different regarding letting your current school know about your overseas dreams. What seems to work for many people is mentioning that you dream of teaching overseas and that you are going to a job fair but it's extremely unlikely you would be offered anything at one of your dream schools/locations. It's usually an exotic/special enough situation that the current administrators don't generally hold it against you for looking but then are also not blindsided when they get a call for a reference. And we know how much administrator and bosses of any kind "love" surprises/being blind sided.
If you really think that your int'l job searching will hurt you at your current school then I guess hold it back but many (although certainly not all) of the good to better schools will want to check with your current administrator BEFORE actually offering you a job.
Reply
@shawanda
You cant, not and keep the DS on your resume. If they have your resume, they can Google the DS, get your leaderships email address and email them. The only way to truly ensure discretion is make the DS on your resume vague and not researchable. Jut provide them with the other references. I would otherwise concur with @Thames Pirate. Explain the scenario and your concerns, but understand that its best practice and really an operational standard to confirm that there is no misconduct with the immediate DS. In such a case its reasonable to provide them with a contact at your DSs HR/personal department after you have a contract.
You cant, not and keep the DS on your resume. If they have your resume, they can Google the DS, get your leaderships email address and email them. The only way to truly ensure discretion is make the DS on your resume vague and not researchable. Jut provide them with the other references. I would otherwise concur with @Thames Pirate. Explain the scenario and your concerns, but understand that its best practice and really an operational standard to confirm that there is no misconduct with the immediate DS. In such a case its reasonable to provide them with a contact at your DSs HR/personal department after you have a contract.
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Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: London Here I Come
PsyGuy, good point--the school can easily look up and contact your current school if it is on your resume.