Fair deal? Job offer at Taiwan Int'l School

[outoftowner08]

Hi all. My boyfriend and have each been offered positions at an international school in Taiwan. We are thrilled to have an offer to teach at the same school, in the same city.

I'm seeking opinions to determine whether or not this is a good deal for us and where we have room to negotiate.

I would teach English classes (to teach writing-all students speak English); he would teach Social Studies. We would also each coach a sports team.

The contract specifies 25 teaching hours a week, not including the coaching. They offered him 75,000 TWD per month - me, 70,000 TWD. In return, we each requested 75,000 to 80,000 on the official applications but have not yet signed a contract. The job includes health insurance, but not flight or housing. Is this a good deal? I have heard that schools in Taiwan don't pay for housing and flight too often, so I expected that. But I'd like to negotiate for flights if I can.

The contract is for 12 months, (Aug. 1 to July 31) but indicates we are paid 10 times with a bonus at the end. June and July are vacation months. But why the extra month if we are only to receive 10 paychecks and a one-month bonus? 11 paychecks for a year-long contract caught my eye. Is this common?

Also, I need to ask if health insurance is covered for the full year.

They have indicated this is a local hire package, though I suspect other teachers at the school receive better, foreign-hire packages if they get their jobs through placement agencies for international schools. We worked directly with the school. And we are not currently in Taiwan.

We're not in it for the money, but I do want to make sure we're fairly compensated and able to pay lingering bills back home.

Also, I would suspect it is fair to get some kind of stipend in the contract for coaching. I'd like this to be spelled out. It currently isn't.

Any thoughts/relative experiences/opinions/advice would be greatly appreciated.

[guest5]

I don't know anything about the cost of living in Taiwan, but personally I would be hesitant to sign a local hire contract. Many international school teachers contact schools directly and don't go through a recruiting agency, yet get overseas hire contracts. Once you are hired as a local hire, you probably won't be able to switch to overseas status at that school. You also want to find out what the visa situation will be. Usually local hires are people who are already in the country and are sponsored by their spouse as a dependent. Did the school indicate whether they hire all their people as local hires or whether they do hire some as overseas hires? If they do give some teachers an overseas package, why not you? You are already saving them $$ by not going through a job fair. If a school hires at an ISS fair, for example, they have to also pay a placement fee.

[ichiro]

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[mexteacher]

I lived in Taiwan in the early 2000's. I worked for an international school in the northern part of Taipei. I can give you some cost of living numbers (for Taipei, Taiwan) for you to work with, but please keep in mind that they are a few years out of date.

(I've just checked and the exchange rate now is about what it was when I was there.)

I was paid nearly twice what you have been offered (foreign hire packages are usually MUCH better than local hire and I was at one of the best paying schools in Asia). (Also, I had more than 5 years of teaching experience and a masters.) When I coached a team, I was paid extra.

Rent was about 25,000 NTD for a one-bedroom smallish apartment in Tien Mu. Some people paid about 40,000 NTD for a two bedroom. However, I seem to remember something about rents being cheaper in other parts of the city (Tien Mu is a bit upscale). I spent another 17,000 NTD per month on food, restaurants, entertainment, a little shopping, and transportation. I wasn't being extravagant, but I also wasn't trying to pinch pennies. While cost of living in Taiwan isn't nearly as expensive as Japan, it is also not nearly as cheap as Thailand.

Leaving the island is costly. Tickets to most places in Asia will run you about 400-600 USD, the the states about 800+ USD. Public transportation is good and relatively inexpensive. I bought a scooter for 25,000 NTD. Utilities aren't horribly expensive. My electricity bill averaged about 50 USD a month.

I can't think of anything else right now. Feel free to post other questions if you have them.

[outoftowner08]

Hi there. We haven't signed a contract or negotiated yet. So I could, reasonably, ask for 140,000 TWD per month?

Keep in mind that I have almost no teaching experience, and my boyfriend is a first year teacher. I want to negotiate, but I don't want to negotiate my way out of an offer.

However, I think they should give us an overseas package. It's ridiculous that they haven't.

Thanks for clueing me in to the cost of living!

[mexteacher]

Instead of asking for such a steep increase, perhaps you can ask to see a copy of the pay scale and package for foreign hire and local hire. Then, go from there. If the school is in the habit of hiring locally, it is possible they won't have a foreign hire package. If they have a foreign hire package, but are refusing to offer it to you, that is a red flag. Your minimal or lack of experience shouldn't be what qualifies you for foreign hire status. Good luck.

PS. The nearly 140,000 NTD I mentioned in the last posting included all benefits--housing, COLA, salary, etc.

[outoftowner08]

Thanks again. That is a nice suggestion as a diplomatic way to get straight answers and see if the school is actin' shady.

I have e-mailed my contact and asked for examples of foreign and local hire packages. I also asked why we are being offered local hire packages when we are not in Taiwan.

We'll see how it goes from there. I hope they are willing to bend. We are hard working and smart, with degrees from nice Uni's, so they should be!

At the same time, this could be a foot-in-the-door experience with the international school system, even if we have to put up with some junk for one year.

I used to be a lowly newspaper reporter for a greedy corporate media company (i.e. the whole shabang was run by the king of fraud, Conrad Black). In-less-than-perfect circumstances, I got valuable experience and won a few awards. There are positives and negatives to every work environment, but I think you have control, ultimately, over the good it does you. You know?

[TexianTravel]

I understand the concept about a foot in the door, but make sure that door doesn't crush your foot!

At my old school, which is so horrible even someone who didn't accept a position posted a warning, there was an extremely capable teacher I greatly respected. Narmer was her only overseas experience, and she is returning to the states and never teaching overseas again. Another teacher is ending a 10 year overseas career because of Narmer. My husband and I also ended our overseas careers because of Narmer, but it was more because our daughter got such an inferior education we might retain her. We couldn't risk that happening again.

I'm not saying that you don't learn from bad experiences, but some experiences can be so bad they sour you on ever trying such a thing again. I would hate to see that happen to someone else.

[puka2]

Total Red Flag. Don't sell yourself short. I have been overseas since 2001 and have met lots of teachers. No one offers local hire contracts to people not in country UNLESS they are coming in with a spouse that already is getting housing, flights etc. for them.
There is a real teacher shortage right now. Job fairs are short of applicants and schools are growing. Sign up for a late fair with Search or ISS that happen in the next couple of weeks. Other options are TIE online or QSI. Even with your limited experience you can do much better for your first overseas contract. Another hint: Ask what a teaching couple can save after normal living expenses, and a bit of travel on xmas and spring breaks. That is a big indicator of how good the contract is. This stats are on the Search website and on the paperwork given at the fairs.
Good Luck!

[outoftowner08]

What is the Search Web site?-Juliana

[markholmes]

www.search-associates.com
Also look at;
www.iss.edu
www.cois.org
www.uni.edu/placement/overseas/

[happychappy]

Hi out of towner, I am currently living and teaching at an international school in Taipei and perhaps I can give you some current advice. If the school is the one I am thinking of (named after a Republic in the Caribbean) then stay away from it. Said school has currently failed to renew the contracts of four good foreign teachers simply because they feel they can hire cheaper teachers. There is no management structure to this school and no salary scale as teachers negotiate their own pay. The salaray quoted (70 000) is quite low for international teaching in Taiwan and a young inexperienced teacher would be on something like 90 000 NT$ at one of the better schools. However, asking for a salary of 140 000 NT$ would be unreasonable as even TAS wouldn't pay that for a new teacher. However, as one poster indicated, the overall package for an overseas hire should be around 140 000 for a new teacher. The school in question does not provide overseas packages to any teachers which is another reason to avoid it. If you really want to come to Taiwan, I suggest coming to teach English over the summer, trying to get supply work at Taipei American School next academic year and then once you have your foot in the door, getting a full time position there. That still won't make you an overseas hire though which means you will never get the housing allowance or flights home. Or better yet, go to a job fair as someone already suggested. Best of luck but avoid the school named after a Catholic order (if my hunch is correct)