Dear all,
Frist year on international school circuit. What would you say is a reasonable amount of time for maternity leave?
What do your schools offer in this regard?
Thanks!
Taking Leave
A reasonable amount of time is whatever you agreed to when you signed your contract.
Or it's a number that you determined in advance of recruiting, and you didn't accept any offer with a lower number.
Honestly, maternity is such a personal thing, and there are so many different cultural norms, I don't think there is a standard number. You need to decide for yourself what you need.
But please don't blame the school if their number is lower than yours. All schools are different, and unless they actively lied to you at recruiting, it is your responsibility to ask the question before you sign. (As it is your responsibility to ask all questions which are important to you personally. It is not the school's responsibility to guess which of 713 possible questions are the 21 which matter most to you.)
Or it's a number that you determined in advance of recruiting, and you didn't accept any offer with a lower number.
Honestly, maternity is such a personal thing, and there are so many different cultural norms, I don't think there is a standard number. You need to decide for yourself what you need.
But please don't blame the school if their number is lower than yours. All schools are different, and unless they actively lied to you at recruiting, it is your responsibility to ask the question before you sign. (As it is your responsibility to ask all questions which are important to you personally. It is not the school's responsibility to guess which of 713 possible questions are the 21 which matter most to you.)
-
shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
Reply
I actually disagree, if your going to get pregnant your first year is better then your second year.
It depends where you are, in WE and in most countries there is national law prescribing how much maternity leave your entitled too. WE can be very generous. Outside of that almost all schools have a policy on how much leave you can take. Dont be afraid to take it all.
if your going to ask for leave you should ask for a semester or a whole year (academic year). if you ask for only a couple months a school wont be able to hire a qualified replacement teacher unless there is a local teacher available. In such cases a substitute who is unlikely to know your subject will end up babysitting your class, or depending on the grade level staff will be shifted to cover your classes. If your out a semester or a year a school can reasonably attract a qualified maternity cover teacher to fill your spot.
Getting pregnant your second year I feel is worse because new moms dont just come back to work after giving birth. They get obsessed with baby stuff, and that usually causes more impact on the school. Knowing this if your coming off maternity at the end of a renewal year, then you may very likely just not be rehired, and having missed the last year of school your reference might be "short". If you come back to work in your second year, you will be able to show that your new baby isnt a distraction and obstacle your teaching duties.
Also understand that in many cultures and countries (such as Japan) when a woman has children it usually signals her exit from her career. If this is your first child, a school may just assume getting pregnant means you wont be working anymore.
It depends where you are, in WE and in most countries there is national law prescribing how much maternity leave your entitled too. WE can be very generous. Outside of that almost all schools have a policy on how much leave you can take. Dont be afraid to take it all.
if your going to ask for leave you should ask for a semester or a whole year (academic year). if you ask for only a couple months a school wont be able to hire a qualified replacement teacher unless there is a local teacher available. In such cases a substitute who is unlikely to know your subject will end up babysitting your class, or depending on the grade level staff will be shifted to cover your classes. If your out a semester or a year a school can reasonably attract a qualified maternity cover teacher to fill your spot.
Getting pregnant your second year I feel is worse because new moms dont just come back to work after giving birth. They get obsessed with baby stuff, and that usually causes more impact on the school. Knowing this if your coming off maternity at the end of a renewal year, then you may very likely just not be rehired, and having missed the last year of school your reference might be "short". If you come back to work in your second year, you will be able to show that your new baby isnt a distraction and obstacle your teaching duties.
Also understand that in many cultures and countries (such as Japan) when a woman has children it usually signals her exit from her career. If this is your first child, a school may just assume getting pregnant means you wont be working anymore.
-
StereoTyped
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:51 pm
[quote="sid"]A reasonable amount of time is whatever you agreed to when you signed your contract.
Or it's a number that you determined in advance of recruiting, and you didn't accept any offer with a lower number.
Honestly, maternity is such a personal thing, and there are so many different cultural norms, I don't think there is a standard number. You need to decide for yourself what you need.
But please don't blame the school if their number is lower than yours. All schools are different, and unless they actively lied to you at recruiting, it is your responsibility to ask the question before you sign. (As it is your responsibility to ask all questions which are important to you personally. It is not the school's responsibility to guess which of 713 possible questions are the 21 which matter most to you.)[/quote]
Thanks for your incredibly UNHELPFUL response, Sid. I'm not an idiot, I'm aware that I have signed a contract and am now responsible for whatever repercussions that might have. I get it. You clearly missed the point of my question which was simply to get a comparison between schools.
To everyone else, thanks for your HELPFUL responses! Appreciated!
Or it's a number that you determined in advance of recruiting, and you didn't accept any offer with a lower number.
Honestly, maternity is such a personal thing, and there are so many different cultural norms, I don't think there is a standard number. You need to decide for yourself what you need.
But please don't blame the school if their number is lower than yours. All schools are different, and unless they actively lied to you at recruiting, it is your responsibility to ask the question before you sign. (As it is your responsibility to ask all questions which are important to you personally. It is not the school's responsibility to guess which of 713 possible questions are the 21 which matter most to you.)[/quote]
Thanks for your incredibly UNHELPFUL response, Sid. I'm not an idiot, I'm aware that I have signed a contract and am now responsible for whatever repercussions that might have. I get it. You clearly missed the point of my question which was simply to get a comparison between schools.
To everyone else, thanks for your HELPFUL responses! Appreciated!
-
wntriscoming
- Posts: 114
- Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:44 am
I agree with Sid. Whatever you signed to is what is reasonable.
I've worked at a school that gave 10 weeks paid leave, and only allowed after your 3rd year of working there.
I've worked at a school that gave 10 weeks paid, inclusive of holidays, so if your baby is born in June, you actually get NO leave, because your weeks are during the summer.
I haven't heard of more than 12 weeks, paid. I have heard of schools willing to renegotiate the contract if you take off more than the leave allowance.
In the U.S. you can have 12 weeks of leave, but unless you're in California, it's unpaid leave.
So there are a few comparisons for you.
I've worked at a school that gave 10 weeks paid leave, and only allowed after your 3rd year of working there.
I've worked at a school that gave 10 weeks paid, inclusive of holidays, so if your baby is born in June, you actually get NO leave, because your weeks are during the summer.
I haven't heard of more than 12 weeks, paid. I have heard of schools willing to renegotiate the contract if you take off more than the leave allowance.
In the U.S. you can have 12 weeks of leave, but unless you're in California, it's unpaid leave.
So there are a few comparisons for you.
-
Snowbeavers
- Posts: 72
- Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2009 11:56 pm
Interesting to compare countries for maternity leave. A good read...
[url]http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/05/22 ... 36120.html[/url]
[quote]The United States, along with Papua New Guinea, Swaziland, Liberia and Lesotho are some of the only countries in the world that provide no type of financial support for mothers, according to a study done by McGill University’s Institute for Health and Social Policy.[/quote]
Sweden has the highest with 420 days (at 80% salary).
[url]http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/05/22 ... 36120.html[/url]
[quote]The United States, along with Papua New Guinea, Swaziland, Liberia and Lesotho are some of the only countries in the world that provide no type of financial support for mothers, according to a study done by McGill University’s Institute for Health and Social Policy.[/quote]
Sweden has the highest with 420 days (at 80% salary).
Apologies if I fell short of your expectations. Lucky for you, I don't charge my fee unless the customer is satisfied. :lol:
Comparisons? Here are some.
A good number of schools do not give paid maternity leave in the first year of service. (A result of schools feeling taken advantage of when new staff turn up pregnant, or take two maternity leaves in a two year contract, and then resign. I'm not taking sides here, just reporting.)
Many schools are legally bound to follow the country's maternity/paternity policies. Western Europe is a good example, but not the only one. Take Sweden - both mother and father get some days, but the bulk of the leave can be taken by either parent.
Pregnant in Central America? Laws against firing pregnant women can be so strong, that no organization would dare touch you at any point during your pregnancy or for a good long bit after you return to work after the birth. (I well remember one case where the mother never informed the school she was pregnant, as she had decided to terminate the pregnancy. Before the termination, she was fired for cause. The woman had the termination, and then sued the school for firing her while she was pregnant. The school lost a bundle.)
There are schools with as little as 4 weeks leave.
I've heard a rumor of a school with no leave at all, but I can't verify that.
Many good schools are flexible and will allow some negotiation, so the mother can take a longer leave, with the extended portion unpaid.
I've seen schools go the extra mile for women facing difficulties. One woman found out several months in that her pregnancy would be pretty much normal and full term, but her baby wouldn't live more than 30 minutes after birth. Everyone circled the wagons, and she didn't work another day during her pregnancy. As a new mother, she also received her full maternity leave, which she needed to grieve.
In Qatar, maternity allowances extend past the leave period. Every mother is allowed an hour a day during the baby's first year, technically so they can nurse the baby. Mothers can negotiate whether to take the hour at the beginning, end or middle of the work day.
In many places, maternity leave is specifically allowed in conjunction with the birth, so as has already been said, if the baby is born at the beginning of the summer, there will be no leave. The argument here is that leave is meant to allow the mother and baby to bond, for the mother to be home for those first weeks when everything is so new and difficult, and for the mother to recover from delivery. If that's the reason, it has to happen when the baby is born. Again, not taking sides, just reporting.
Comparisons? Here are some.
A good number of schools do not give paid maternity leave in the first year of service. (A result of schools feeling taken advantage of when new staff turn up pregnant, or take two maternity leaves in a two year contract, and then resign. I'm not taking sides here, just reporting.)
Many schools are legally bound to follow the country's maternity/paternity policies. Western Europe is a good example, but not the only one. Take Sweden - both mother and father get some days, but the bulk of the leave can be taken by either parent.
Pregnant in Central America? Laws against firing pregnant women can be so strong, that no organization would dare touch you at any point during your pregnancy or for a good long bit after you return to work after the birth. (I well remember one case where the mother never informed the school she was pregnant, as she had decided to terminate the pregnancy. Before the termination, she was fired for cause. The woman had the termination, and then sued the school for firing her while she was pregnant. The school lost a bundle.)
There are schools with as little as 4 weeks leave.
I've heard a rumor of a school with no leave at all, but I can't verify that.
Many good schools are flexible and will allow some negotiation, so the mother can take a longer leave, with the extended portion unpaid.
I've seen schools go the extra mile for women facing difficulties. One woman found out several months in that her pregnancy would be pretty much normal and full term, but her baby wouldn't live more than 30 minutes after birth. Everyone circled the wagons, and she didn't work another day during her pregnancy. As a new mother, she also received her full maternity leave, which she needed to grieve.
In Qatar, maternity allowances extend past the leave period. Every mother is allowed an hour a day during the baby's first year, technically so they can nurse the baby. Mothers can negotiate whether to take the hour at the beginning, end or middle of the work day.
In many places, maternity leave is specifically allowed in conjunction with the birth, so as has already been said, if the baby is born at the beginning of the summer, there will be no leave. The argument here is that leave is meant to allow the mother and baby to bond, for the mother to be home for those first weeks when everything is so new and difficult, and for the mother to recover from delivery. If that's the reason, it has to happen when the baby is born. Again, not taking sides, just reporting.
QSI has a pretty lengthy maternity leave policy, irrespective of when you started working. If you give birth at any point during the school year, you have the rest of the year off. The next school year, you can either work part time (at 77% pay), super part time (not sure of the pay grade, but you'd only teach two periods), or take a full year off unpaid. Before you give birth, they generally give you the month of your due date off as well.
It should be noted that QSI, while allowing a longer period off, doesn't pay for a single day of leave. You cannot take sick days and your end of year bonus is also docked based on how many days you take. The part time pay is only in proportion to what you work -- if you get 77% pay it is because you work a 77% schedule. You don't get 77% pay for working half-time. This may be different from school to school, but what I am reporting are actual, head-office policies. Some directors will do what they can for you to protect your end of year bonus, but others will stick to the letter of the law.
From what I've seen, people can pretty much take the time they want because it is all unpaid.
From what I've seen, people can pretty much take the time they want because it is all unpaid.
-
RunnerGirl
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 6:14 pm
I agree about maternity leave for the first year, but mostly because it's your first year at a new school period, regardless of whether or not you are on the international circuit. My current school allows 84 days because of national laws in this country regarding maternity leave. Depending on where you are, similar legal requirements may apply. Best to ask the specific school I think.