I'm looking into teaching internationally for the first time and am seeking information on the level of healthcare coverage most schools offer.
Do most programs cover preexisting medical conditions?
And, although no one likes to imagine the possibility, in the case of a serious medical issue, would schools typically offer a teacher a leave of absence? Would they be able to keep their job and/or health care?
If you have any first-hand accounts, I would appreciate that as well.
Thanks.
Pre-Existing Medical Conditions/Extended Medical Leave
I'm sure there are exceptions, perhaps in the well-regulated EU for a start, but mostly I think that if you had a serious long-term medical issue, you would eventually lose your job. Schools would have the option of granting you a leave of absence, but this is much tougher in an independent school than it is in a district back home. Back home, you can go on leave, and months or years later when you're ready to come back, they'll slot you in some place in the district, though not necessarily the exact job you left. In a single school, that's hard. If you go on leave, they have to replace you, and if it's more than a week or two, that can mean having to hire a full-time replacement, who likely won't be enticed by an offer that includes 'and when teacher X is ready to return, whenever that is, you're out the door with a week's notice'. Schools can and do hire long-term subs in some cases, and there are agencies that provide such a service internationally, but most schools are under no obligation to do so. It's all good will. If they like you as a teacher, if they see the liklihood that you'll be able to return in a reasonable amount of time, they will probably work with you to find a solution. If you're not so well respected, if it is unclear when or if you'll return, they don't have much reason to go the extra mile. Also consider the benefits question - taking leave internationally is not just a case of ceasing your salary for a while. The school is providing you with housing, annual flights, your child's tuition, medical insurance and who knows what else. If you go on leave, do they also cease paying for those things? And if they did, could you afford to stay in the country? Most schools have policies about these things, but often those only cover more typical shorter medical leaves, say for a week or two, or maternity leave. The longer stuff might be left out of the policy or even forbidden in the policy.
Whether schools cover pre-existing conditions is up to them. I've know many who do and many who don't. I've heard the horror story of a family who specifically inquired in advance about medicine for a specific expensive condition, only to find on arrival that the insurance policy had been changed after they asked (because they asked?) to specifically exclude that exact condition.
But it's not all doom and gloom. For normal medical stuff, like needing a week or two off to recover from an operation, it's all pretty normal and expected. You may not get paid for all the time off, if it exceeds your annual limit of sick days, but you'd get unpaid leave with all benefits.
Whether schools cover pre-existing conditions is up to them. I've know many who do and many who don't. I've heard the horror story of a family who specifically inquired in advance about medicine for a specific expensive condition, only to find on arrival that the insurance policy had been changed after they asked (because they asked?) to specifically exclude that exact condition.
But it's not all doom and gloom. For normal medical stuff, like needing a week or two off to recover from an operation, it's all pretty normal and expected. You may not get paid for all the time off, if it exceeds your annual limit of sick days, but you'd get unpaid leave with all benefits.
What do you have?
It depends on the condition and what you have. There is no easy way to put it. If your in europe, long term medical absence can be anywhere from 1 year to indefinite. During this time you will qualify for disability insurance which pays a percentage of your salary. You will also have national healthcare. Housing isnt so much an issue, because schools in europe generally dont provide housing any way. Your school is required to take you back when your doctor determines that you are fit to do so. The only problem would be the tuition waivers, the school would have to allow your kids to continue for that school year, but depending on the country you may have to pay tuition, or enroll your kids in a municipal (public) school.
In Asia, it means you loose your job. Just about all school contracts have a stipulation that absence for more then 30 days, is the same as abandoning your position. They would probably provide you with some money and return airfare, and you may get to keep your medical for a little while, but basically your out. They wouldnt likely keep a position available for you in the future, and as an admin, it would be an expensive risk to do so.
In Asia, it means you loose your job. Just about all school contracts have a stipulation that absence for more then 30 days, is the same as abandoning your position. They would probably provide you with some money and return airfare, and you may get to keep your medical for a little while, but basically your out. They wouldnt likely keep a position available for you in the future, and as an admin, it would be an expensive risk to do so.
Sorry PsyGuy, but can I contradict you? I know of a fellow teacher in Brunei who actually has been back in her home country fighting cancer since January and doing chemo; she will be returning to work in September. Perhaps this is an exception to the rule, but it's true nonetheless. BUT, I agree that it probably isn't the norm.
Absolutely
Absolutely, it should go without saying there are always exceptions. Some teachers are worth the risk (What happens if your friend relapses?). There is also a significant difference between being rehired for a job and having job protections. What does the school HAVE to do, and what CAN the school choose to do? My interpretation is that the OP was more interested in what protections and business practices a school is most likely to have happen.
Thanks for the responses.
In my specific situation, I had a heart transplant more than twelve years ago. I take expensive medication, but I haven't had any problems in more than a decade. I'm in good health, play in a soccer league, ran a 5k a few months ago... but there's always the outside chance that something could go wrong.
When interviewing for a job, how up-front would you recommend I be about this? Obviously, I need to find about insurance and pre-existing conditions and what not, but I worry that putting all my cards on the table and mentioning the transplant would potentially scare off any employer. On the other hand, I don't want to quit my job, sell all my stuff, move halfway across the world, only to be let go or not covered.
How would you guys handle that dilemma?
In my specific situation, I had a heart transplant more than twelve years ago. I take expensive medication, but I haven't had any problems in more than a decade. I'm in good health, play in a soccer league, ran a 5k a few months ago... but there's always the outside chance that something could go wrong.
When interviewing for a job, how up-front would you recommend I be about this? Obviously, I need to find about insurance and pre-existing conditions and what not, but I worry that putting all my cards on the table and mentioning the transplant would potentially scare off any employer. On the other hand, I don't want to quit my job, sell all my stuff, move halfway across the world, only to be let go or not covered.
How would you guys handle that dilemma?
Advice
Don't tell them. Your medical condition is only relevant in how it DIRECTLY effects your ability to do your job, and work with children. Its incidental anyway and any one of us could have a heart attack at any time. If your in europe tell your doctor of course, in asia be careful who you talk too. If your school has an "infirmary" Id be careful about telling them, medical information laws are very minor then they are in the west. Its likely that the head of the school may be told. Of course if you go to hospital or a third . outside clinic tell them. Once your hired and have a contract its really your call (personally Id inform the health center).
The reason why you DONT want to say so before the interview is because recruitment selection becomes less about choosing the right person and more about discarding the wrong people. You get 100 application for one position, you start not by looking for the 1 in 100, but by looking for the ones you dont want, and once the pile gets narrowed, the candidates start looking a LOT alike. Its why interviews are so important, they arent looking to see how great you are but how much they "like you". At that point minor insignificant things like age, and family status, and yes medical conditions start becoming reasons for removing someone from the candidate pool.
The reason why you DONT want to say so before the interview is because recruitment selection becomes less about choosing the right person and more about discarding the wrong people. You get 100 application for one position, you start not by looking for the 1 in 100, but by looking for the ones you dont want, and once the pile gets narrowed, the candidates start looking a LOT alike. Its why interviews are so important, they arent looking to see how great you are but how much they "like you". At that point minor insignificant things like age, and family status, and yes medical conditions start becoming reasons for removing someone from the candidate pool.
Yeah keep it quiet, when you get there hit up another insurance agency and apply for pre-existing condition.
I know in Singapore, AIA, does NOT and WILL NOT pay for anything if there is any SLIGHTEST chance that a condition was pre-exisiting (even if there is no proof or prior medical treatment) within the first year of living there.
I know in Singapore, AIA, does NOT and WILL NOT pay for anything if there is any SLIGHTEST chance that a condition was pre-exisiting (even if there is no proof or prior medical treatment) within the first year of living there.
-
stellalocal
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:21 am
There's no need to tell them at the interview, but I would ask about the heath insurance before accepting a post. I always ask, it's quite justified and schools should be willing to answer questions. You don't need to tell them about your history, people get ill overseas and you want to know that if it happens you'll be looked after.
With regards to how it's dealt with at schools, I knew quite a few people that had health issues in Cairo; cancer, mystery viruses and various surgeries, they all had no problems being treated (overseas if necessary) and getting time off (up to pretty much the whole year) and then returning to their job. At my own school, full pay only continued for 6 days and then was reduced to about 75% I think for a further 84 days. After that you didn't get paid.
With regards to how it's dealt with at schools, I knew quite a few people that had health issues in Cairo; cancer, mystery viruses and various surgeries, they all had no problems being treated (overseas if necessary) and getting time off (up to pretty much the whole year) and then returning to their job. At my own school, full pay only continued for 6 days and then was reduced to about 75% I think for a further 84 days. After that you didn't get paid.
Again, thank you for the advice.
Maybe I made a mistake, but I did tell the director the situation. We had already spoken multiple times and he had offered me the job. He had been straightforward with me, which I appreciate, so I felt comfortable disclosing the information. He can look at my employee service record and see how few sick days I've taken throughout my career.
My true fear is not being upfront, accepting a post, getting there, and then having it be an issue once I've quit my current job and moved across the globe.
If he rescinds the offer, it makes me doubt that the school is a place I actually want to work for...better to find out before I risk my entire current life, I suppose. At least that's my thinking.
Hopefully it works out.
Maybe I made a mistake, but I did tell the director the situation. We had already spoken multiple times and he had offered me the job. He had been straightforward with me, which I appreciate, so I felt comfortable disclosing the information. He can look at my employee service record and see how few sick days I've taken throughout my career.
My true fear is not being upfront, accepting a post, getting there, and then having it be an issue once I've quit my current job and moved across the globe.
If he rescinds the offer, it makes me doubt that the school is a place I actually want to work for...better to find out before I risk my entire current life, I suppose. At least that's my thinking.
Hopefully it works out.
-
stellalocal
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:21 am
Yeah, sounds fair enough dealing with it that way. Makes sense to clear it up before you get there rather than having it hanging over your head as a worry. I don't think it necessarily needs to be mentioned at the interview stage, maybe when discussing job offer is a good time.
I don't have pre-existing conditions but I did recently ask for full health insurance details before accepting my new post this year. I think it's an important part of the package and the longer I've been overseas and the older I get, the more I realise how things can strike out of the blue and the need for good cover.
Good luck with the job, and I agree, if the offer is rescinded then you're better off not being at that school anyway.
I don't have pre-existing conditions but I did recently ask for full health insurance details before accepting my new post this year. I think it's an important part of the package and the longer I've been overseas and the older I get, the more I realise how things can strike out of the blue and the need for good cover.
Good luck with the job, and I agree, if the offer is rescinded then you're better off not being at that school anyway.
No
Heads can build trust so fast its scary. If they rescind the offer its a job you lost that you didn't need too. Your personal health is NEVER a job recruitment issue. You shouldnt ever feel that your body is ever something that should be an employment issue, its not. There are parts of your privacy that are entitled to be your secrets, regardless what you may be made to feel. Its none of there business, dont be guilted, or guilt yourself into thinking its theres.
More nonsense from Dave Psyguy
"Your personal health is NEVER a job recruitment issue." This is not only wrong, it is stupidly, dangerously wrong. Many school medical insurance policies have a disclaimer that says they will not cover previous conditions. If that is the case then you have an obligation to disclose or be prepared to suffer the consequences. Do you seriously think that if you had a heart transplant and then suffered a further heart problem that the doctor treating you wouldn't notice? Certainly, you would be obliged to pay for any medical care you did receive - unless you happened to be in a country with a state health service - and you may well be deemed in breach of contract because you failed to tell the truth. So you are not only at risk of losing your job, you're risking a situation that could be financially ruinous.
Most of what Dave Psyguy tells you is baloney, but I don't really care when he gets his facts wrong about UK universities or transporting dogs. This latest idiocy is too important to let slide.
Most of what Dave Psyguy tells you is baloney, but I don't really care when he gets his facts wrong about UK universities or transporting dogs. This latest idiocy is too important to let slide.
Sigh
I was thinking the same thing about your advice.
You have an ABSOLUTE obligation FIRST to yourself, and your own health. It is not STUPIDLY dangerous, disclosing the condition would prevent you from getting treatment, period. At least if you keep your medical problems to yourself you can get away with it until someone finds out. Most medical conditions such as high blood pressure, cholesterol, etc, etc, dont have tell tale signs of being pre-existing.
Aside from that your still full of it, my personal health is my business, and my doctors, not the schools or my employers. What ever health policy the school has was negotiated with the provider and the school, no one asked my opinion. The school isnt entitled to the truth about my personal medical history.
Even if that werent enough, the prior post specifically stated that "Your personal health is NEVER a job recruitment issue." Even if you were right thats an employment issue, NOT a recruitment issue. If i have to declare a preexisting condition and eat the expense for it fine, thats an issue to be discussed when the school ACTUALLy becomes my employer, not during the recruiting phase.
You have an ABSOLUTE obligation FIRST to yourself, and your own health. It is not STUPIDLY dangerous, disclosing the condition would prevent you from getting treatment, period. At least if you keep your medical problems to yourself you can get away with it until someone finds out. Most medical conditions such as high blood pressure, cholesterol, etc, etc, dont have tell tale signs of being pre-existing.
Aside from that your still full of it, my personal health is my business, and my doctors, not the schools or my employers. What ever health policy the school has was negotiated with the provider and the school, no one asked my opinion. The school isnt entitled to the truth about my personal medical history.
Even if that werent enough, the prior post specifically stated that "Your personal health is NEVER a job recruitment issue." Even if you were right thats an employment issue, NOT a recruitment issue. If i have to declare a preexisting condition and eat the expense for it fine, thats an issue to be discussed when the school ACTUALLy becomes my employer, not during the recruiting phase.