I am hoping to begin one of these certification programs soon. My preference is Teach Now due to the reasons PsyGuy and others have outlined many times (mostly due to the additional field experience). The issue of course is finding a school that would be willing to hand over their classroom to me.

To further complicate things, my plan is to teach ESL on the side to pay the bills while I'm going through the program (the certification I'm pursuing is 7-12 Math, so unrelated to ESL). So I'm in a bit of a catch-22, in the sense that: 1) I need to find an ESL job wherever I'm going, but I'm not sure where to apply/accept offers from because 2) I don't know which locations, if any, I'll be able to find a cooperating IS for the Teach Now program. And if the answer to the latter is none, then the same question goes for the Teacher Ready program.

Should I use a recruitment agency for this kind of thing? And if so, which one? Some relevant info:

-I'm getting certified in 7-12 Math and have an unrelated Bachelor's degree with no teaching experience
-I applied and was accepted to Teach Now, but there's no binding agreement/financial commitment and I still have to find an IS to work with.
-I am quite open in terms of locations; I'll stop short of saying I'll go anywhere, but the list of places I'd say no to is pretty short.
-Teaching ESL is how I plan to pay bills temporarily but is not a hard requirement per se if other options are available.
-I'd like to start ASAP.

Do I have any shot at finding an IS to work with me for TN somewhere, or should I just opt for TR?

shadowjack wrote:
> Cookies4u my advice? If you are American do Teach Now. Do it in Korea.
> There are far more ESL schools there to employ you and many international
> schools that would sponsor you to do your practical teaching.
>
> Second choice, as you seem set on - do it in CSA.
>
> If you are going to choose the PGCEi, my advice would be to run it through
> Washington DC BEFORE you commit to it. DC needs to approve it for
> reciprocity. If they don't, you just wasted a ton of cash and time for
> nothing. In the end, you want a qualification that is good and portable
> ASAP.
>
> Medellin Heel has done a similar route to you and knows what he is talking
> about.
>
> Just my two halalas - good luck with whatever you decide.
>
> Shad

Is there a way I can send Medellin a private message? As I understand it PMs aren't available in this forum but are in the member's forum...However I don't see any posts by him there, and I'm guessing spamming the forum in the off-chance that he sees my post would be frowned upon!

"QTS is very easy to obtain as an OTT, and it works if all you teach is what your academic preparation/degree is in (there is no PD). However, no BS (British School) is going to equate a foreigner with QTS and no experience in the UK NC as knowing anything about British education, curriculum, operations, or organization."

Two questions on this:

1. Would generalist roles like Primary be considered under the umbrella of what my degree (BGS) is in?

2. When you say no British School will assume a foreigner with a QTS and no experience knows anything about their system, are you referring to BS in the UK or all British IS? Or are they essentially the same in that regard? (sorry if it seems like I'm being obtuse, just want to make sure my understanding is clear)

Thanks once again for the informative reply. Is the preference for Teach Now > Teach Ready > PGCEi directly correlated to the field experience component? I've seen you say the California CLEAR and QTS are the two best certifications to have, and that the CLEAR process is obnoxious, so why not go the route that leads me to a QTS?

What are LHs and OSHs?

I'm not taking the advice to go with a traditional EPP/ITT program lightly, and it's given me pause about these alternative options. But as you can probably tell, I really want to move out of the US (particularly my state) sooner rather than later. I really don't much care about how much I make for the first couple years, but if there is still a significant longer-term glass ceiling as a result of nontraditional certification, that is definitely a concern. I checked licensing requirements for my state (North Dakota), and it would take at least an extra year to meet the criteria.

Thanks again for the advice posted so far. The past month and a half has been pretty busy and I've let this slide somewhat, but it's getting to the point where I need to make a concrete decision. I would prefer an option that allows me to re-locate outside the US while pursuing certification if at all possible. I did some digging for more info re: certification options and I'm inclined to go the PGCEi - US state certification - QTS route, but still have some questions:

1. On the University of Nottingham's website, their PGCEi entry requirements state that applicants should have "an approved degree with at least second class honours or equivalent". As an American I don't know what this is, but I assume my degree would be workable since it was suggested as an option here? It also says I should be an "established educator" (clearly not, but again is it safe to say there's leeway on this?) https://www.nottingham.ac.uk/education/ ... ments.aspx

2. Since my preferred region is CSA, I was eyeing the venues in Peru and Ecuador. However, the start dates for those courses are June 1, and I won't finish my degree until late July (and whatever additional time it takes to get transcripts after classes end). I've arranged for my final semester to be all online classes so I am flexible in that sense, but I don't know if I would be allowed to take the PGCEi concurrently in CSA, or if I'd have to choose a different location with a later starting date: https://www.nottingham.ac.uk/education/ ... index.aspx

3. According to PsyGuy's response, there are bottom-tier ISs that will hire on the basis of a (any) degree alone. I assume CSA is a region that has some of these schools, where I might be able to find work while completing the PGCEi. What would be the best way for me to get in touch with them? TIE, AASSA? I know there are supposedly some that hire based on PGCEi alone, but I need to do something while I'm obtaining it. I wouldn't be opposed to working at a language school temporarily to make ends meet, but I don't really want to invest time and money into a CELTA or similar for a position I'd probably have less than a year.

4. I'm not sure I understand exactly how the transition from PGCEi -> state certification -> QTS works. PsyGuy mentions PGCEi application to "certain jurisdictions" in the US - which jurisdictions? Does the PGCEi allow me to take the relevant Praxis exams without completing additional training? And once I have that, I can apply for NQT immediately and after one year be granted QTS? I haven't been able to find anything specific about this.

While I'm at it, I have some further questions about subject area. Am I correct in assuming that once I am certified in a particular jurisdiction, the process of adding additional subjects becomes simpler (as in, passing the tests and paying a fee)?

Based on the suggestions here, I was thinking I would pursue a Primary cert. to cast the widest net, possibly considering either Maths or TOK as well depending on how things progress. I was leaning toward Math initially, then I noticed some variance in the 6-12 requirements. I saw the following sample test which covered Algebra, Geometry, Trig, Calc, Stats, some logic questions, and teaching-related questions. If that reflects the test I'd have to take, I think I'd be fine, with some review. However, I also saw a curriculum for 6-12 Math cert. that included Linear Algebra (which I've spent little time on) and Abstract Algebra (which I haven't touched).

While I hope I could learn them in the available timeframe, I'm not sure it would be a good idea to add addition pressure to what will probably already be a busy period of time. So I guess it goes back to the question of which jurisdiction PGCEi would qualify me for, and which test I'd have to take. Either way, I would probably end up using the PGCEi credits towards completing an MA. I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting some other questions, but hopefully they will come. Also if you feel strongly that I should be doing the Texas ACP, Teach Now, or Teacher Ready instead of the PGCEi route, please say so :)

You're right, I was confusing the certification types in the Texas ACP program.

Putting aside financial and time commitment discrepancies, is there any difference between the Texas ACP route and Teach Ready in terms of marketability? What is the BOS S.A. fair and when is it? Sorry, I tried searching but

When you say there's a small number of upper-tier IS internships available with the Texas option, is it safe to assume there will still be lower-tier IS options available somewhere upon completing the certification?

On that note, how much mobility is there between the tiers? If I go with one of the "expedient" certifications and start with a third-tier school and all goes well, how many years should I expect before I'm competitive for 2nd tier? 1st tier? Assume I stay single with no dependents. I'm still trying to gauge the price I'm paying by not doing two years domestically first.

I'm sort of trying to take your scoring system and project roughly how many points I can achieve after X years, but some things are still unclear to me, such as:

-How soon I would have access to a school where I could gain IB/AP/IGCSE experience
-What would qualify as a special skill set - For example am I correct in assuming that my music experience would qualify if I decide to specialize in Music, but otherwise wouldn't be (since it wouldn't really be synergistic with anything else)?
-What "Cross Certified" means in this context...Does it just mean being certified in related fields like Math and Physics?

PsyGuy Applicant Scoring System:
1) 1 pt / 2 years Experience (Max 10 Years)
2) 1 pt - Advance Degree (Masters)
3) 1 pt - Cross Certified (Must be schedule-able)
4) 1 pt - Curriculum Experience (IB, AP, IGCSE)
5) 1pt - Logistical Hire (Single +.5 pt, Couple +1 pt)
6) .5 pt - Previous International School Experience (standard 2 year contract)
7) .5 pt - Leadership Experience/Role (+.25 HOD, +.5 Coordinator)
8) .5 pt - Extra Curricular (Must be schedule-able)
9) .25 pt - Special Populations (Must be qualified)
10) .25 pt - Special Skill Set (Must be documentable AND marketable)

MedellinHotel:

I hear you. I should be okay on the savings front, if nothing else I can subsidize my income with freelance writing if I have to. If that's a standard compensation package for S. Korea and it's not too hard to arrange the field experience with one of the online ACPs, it's definitely tempting. I really want to feel out my options and see if I can get what I need from S. America though.

Thanks a lot for your detailed reply PsyGuy, I've learned a lot from reading some of your other posts here as well.

Re: job prospects and IE vs. ESOL, I was referring more to compensation than availability, although availability matters to an extent of course. From what I understand IE offers better pay and benefits than ESL jobs, substantially in some cases. Suffice to say I'm not going into education for the money, but I'm not going to pretend it's irrelevant either. I'm aware I lack qualifications at the moment and I'm happy to scrape by with whatever job allows me to get my foot in the door. But I'd like to eventually not only pay the bills, but also save some non-trivial amount of money. Correct me if I'm wrong, but IE seems to have more potential in this regard. Also, as you said, there's always ESOL positions available somewhere. If I go into IE I can always switch over to ESOL, but not the reverse so much.

Just to clarify when I mention compensation I'm mostly thinking in terms of the future; I'll take whatever I can get starting out.

You mentioned you were unclear about my educational background...I don't think I can add much that would be relevant, but I'll try to clarify as much as possible:

I started out as a Computer Science major but quickly decided I didn't like it. Most people who drop out of CS do so because of the math requirements, but I was pretty much the opposite - I ended up enjoying the math but disliking the programming.

I switched to an English major but absolutely couldn't stand a couple of the professors, and being a small school it was impossible to avoid them while continuing to pursue the degree so I just ended up settling on a BGS. I currently do part-time freelance writing while attending college, although nothing that's likely to be relevant in the academic world.

Music is probably the oddest one to explain. I took private violin lessons from the age of 5 until my first year of college, have played in orchestras most of my life and won a couple regional solo competitions, but I never had a desire to teach music. I wanted to have a solo career, but realized that is an option for an ultra-tiny percentage of musicians, so I figured I would move on to something else and keep it as a hobby. I don't know if things like this matter, but I won my state's MTNA competition. If the piano and aural skills requirements are similar to those to get a BA in music, it wouldn't be a problem. The main issue would be that I've always hated music theory, and for that reason I'm still leaning against teaching music. Still, with my background it seems like I should at least mention it for consideration.

The other topics are just areas that I am interested in and have spent at least some time learning about. I hadn't heard of TOK before you mentioned it, but after some Googling around it's definitely something I could see myself teaching. Currently mulling over the rest of your comments on subject areas.

Friends: They're pretty important, but I guess everything is relative and I don't know what the trade-offs are.

Let me put it this way. For my first two years of teaching, if I were given the options of:

A) School in China (or pretty much any non-S. American country): $2400/mo. salary with potential to save 50%, relatively nice staff/students/work environment.

B) School in S. America: $1200/mo. salary with potential to save ~10% (maybe), difficult-but-not-impossible students, somewhat unhelpful (but non-adversarial) staff.

I would snap-take B. The numbers might be off and I certainly don't expect to save 50% of anything starting out, I'm just using the figures to make a point. However, if the options are between:

A) School in China: $1200/mo., ~10% savings, and gives me a good chance to work towards a $4-5k/mo. 50% savings potential job in 5-6-7 years

B) School in S. America: same salary/savings, but leads to a ceiling of $2500/mo. or so.

I would take option A.

For my medium-longer term goals, I would say:

$4k/mo.+ in S America >>> $5k/mo. in most Asian countries > $2.5k/mo. in S. America > anything under $4k/mo. in Asia. I realize this is deeply flawed and simplistic since Japan and Bangladesh are both Asian countries, but I hope it gives a rough idea of how I prioritize being in S. America. If a more specific assessment is needed to be useful please let me know.

Admin path: It's really just a consideration for right now, I'm not ready to make a hard commitment to this yet.

Qualifications:

-With the Texas ACP program, I noticed that after you complete the program, there's a 1-year probationary period before you get your full license. Are you limited to where you can teach/intern during that period?

-For the Malaysian IB school, I checked their website but didn't find any tuition info. I will e-mail them and check it out, but do you have a ballpark idea? All I saw was that they have a scholarship available that basically pays for everything, but nothing about how selective they are with the scholarship or what it costs without one. 3 years is a hefty commitment if I'm also going to be significantly in the red afterwards...I wish I had a more quantifiable way to measure its impact. Will it open doors that would otherwise be permanently closed to me, or does it just shift the odds in my favor?

-Teach Now/Ready - Do I have a reasonable chance of finding an accredited IS that will allow me to do my field experience with them? Do I simply reach out to them and ask, or is there a more formal process?

-Intern IT options: If I'm interpreting your description correctly, this sounds like a potentially good option. How difficult is it to get into these for the top-tier schools? Or any school? After completion, do IT interns typically continue at the same IS but with full/normal benefits, or go job-hunting elsewhere? Since it's for fully-credentialed teachers, would it make sense to do the Texas program -> IT internship -> ???

Thanks again for all the information. What would you recommend based on my answers?

I’m going to be graduating later this year with a BGS. I had previously planned on going into ESL teaching, and since the main entrance requirement to that field seems to be any accredited degree, I chose BGS since it gave me more leeway in taking the courses I wanted. After learning more about the job prospects of ESL teachers, I’ve decided I would like to become a licensed teacher and eventually teach at an IS. I’m not particularly close to getting B Ed or any other degree, and I would prefer to just finish the BGS and find another way to get certified (and possibly an MA down the road).

Based on reading these forums, it seems like Teach Now and Teacher Ready are the two main alternate certification routes. My tentative plan is to teach ESL somewhere in South America while completing one of the aforementioned programs. I’m trying to steer away from ESL, but I’m graduating in July, and well, I have to do something. If there are other cert options I should consider please let me know – I’m a resident of North Dakota if it matters, but have no problem going to any other state to get certified. After getting certified I would look for an IT position.

My two main concerns are 1) whether the ESL schools I would be starting out at would qualify for the classroom observation portion of the certifications, and 2) if starting at an ESL school would actually be detrimental and get me labeled as a “tourist teacher” (though I’m not exactly sure what other choice I have).

I’ve also been thinking about what subject to teach…Taken off of Teach Now’s list of subjects, here’s a list of the ones I believe I would have the interest/competence to teach (with more or less review for some of them):

-Middle School English
-Middle School Mathematics
-Mathematics*
-English
-ESL
-Special Ed.
-Health and Phy. Ed.
-Home Economics
-Social Studies
-Performing Arts (Violin specifically)
-Geography (?) – it wasn’t listed on their site but I’ve seen it listed elsewhere as an option

*I’m not sure exactly what’s required at the high end of the grade 12 maths to teach at the better schools. I took two semesters of Calc in college and got As in both of them, but they took a lot of work (well Calc II anyway), and I don’t think I’m especially good at math. It is an interesting topic to me, though.

I would be pretty happy teaching any of the above areas, so from that list it sort of comes down to what subject would give me the best job prospects. Any suggestions appreciated here as well.

Last few things that may or may not be relevant:

-I listed S. America (probably Argentina) as my initial destination because I am good friends with a few teachers there (not at ISs though), and I imagine they could help with getting my first job there. I also spent a semester abroad there and I’m proficient in Spanish.

-I have a strong preference for Latin America (doesn’t have to be Argentina, it just seems like the most obvious choice). That said, I’m ultimately open to a lot of locations in the near-term – there’s really just a handful of ME and African countries I want to avoid if possible. But there would need to be a pretty clear advantage in terms of either compensation or future career trajectory for me to go somewhere outside of Latin America.

-I invite everyone to take a wrecking ball to my current plans and assumptions; the only part I’m probably unwilling to compromise on is the degree (as in, I’ll finish my BGS and get alt. certification instead of changing my current major to a B. Ed or something).

-I’m leaning towards going down the admin route, eventually. I assume that primarily means getting the requisite Masters at some point, but if anything I do now will somehow impact future options in that regard, I’d certainly be interested in hearing about it. It’s far from being a set-in-stone plan though, just something in the back of my mind.

I’m sure I’m forgetting lots of questions, but that’s all for now!