@PsyGuy

Mine weren't at birth. The US govt. doesn't distinguish for this purpose between foreign citizenship at birth and citizenship acquired through naturalization or descent. I have virtually every combination of possibilities for multiple citizenships and paths to get them in my extended family. The only issues that I've seen with citizenship go the opposite direction where OTHER countries disallow dual citizenship and revoke the original citizenship if you accept new citizenship. My understanding is that this is decreasing, but some countries hold out.

@shadowjack

The OP clearly says that he 'read' that the US doesn't offer dual citizenship anymore. That is wrong.

You are correct that some other countries force you to renounce your citizenship if taking another. But the US couldn't care less unless you move or act to renounce your US citizenship, which pretty much takes a direct repudiation.

Others can give you a better idea, but I don't think that you'll do much better salary-wise with your subject, experience, and generally how things are. DODDEA can match that. Otherwise, for a light work load, you have a great paying job.

I think that the IT market will continue to get worse as more people leave education to escape many of the kind of outsiders you described from silicon valley. Teaching in the US is horrific right now, in my opinion. After the housing bubble and mortgage swaps and all that dried up, Wallstreet and Silicon valley have turned their attention to the $$Billions of education dollars available. My career before teaching was higher end IT/management consulting. The people in education related, but outside education roles remind me of the bad attitudes (arrogance, believing they are the smartest person wherever they are, etc) is just as bad with that crowd, but they are like 3rd-stringers talent-wise. I wouldn't be happy in that environment.

Not all of the tech based ed firms are that way, but many are, including the ed branches of places like Apple.

Besides that, the ability to travel easily, unlimited knowledge on the internet, smaller world in general, has taken much of the adventure out of many overseas posts. At one time, few people were brave enough to venture to some remote exotic (to them) post, now there are tons of people. There are posts that are still roughing it, but they are disappearing relative to even a decade and certainly 2 decades ago. I can't see the trend reversing.

I'm kind of just jumping around now because of time---
Retirement is going to be what you make of it. The people who end up really well set in retirement in spite of a lower paying job made sacrifices along the way. A basic investing book (or website) will give you an idea of how much you'd need to set aside starting now to retire when and how you want. For many, many people (including me) this isn't looking pretty. The only thing that will allow me to stop working before I'm 90 is that I have permanent residence and family property in a developing country where I can live on much less than here.

But, if you find a job at a good, non-poverty, school in the US, you could earn roughly 2+% per year of your salary towards retirement. So, in Colorado, I've been back in the US 5 years, so I could receive 5x2.2=11% of my highest salary once I turn 60. Since you are much younger, it can add up. On the other hand, the chance that the corporatists will destroy pensions is pretty high.

Hopefully that at least starts a conversation for you. Good luck. It can be rewarding if you learn to work the system.

Tech Leadership. I have a question about technology coaching and leadership positions. I see things come up on TIEonline, but often they look like they are promoting the standard salary scale for some of the positions I've seen.

I'm hoping for general information, like:

What kind of tech positions do you usually see at 1st or high 2nd tier schools? I understand the debates around tier, but I will never again, under any circumstances, work for anything but the top school or two in most countries.

I'm assuming that the tech 'workers' or non-admin/ed types are local hires--is that usually correct?

Pay--in your experiences is there a higher scale for tech focused positions? ( again, I recognize that there are a variety of tech positions, but generally).

Do schools seem to follow the advice of the tech admins that they hire, or do they constantly chase after shiny things to impress parents?

What is the best path? Search? ISS? TIE? Direct? LinkedIn?

Any other general thoughts or advice?

As a background--My first career was finance, second was software consulting, third was teaching. After about 10 years in the classroom and returning to the hell that 'reform' has made teaching in the US, I have escaped to the role of building tech coordinator for an elementary school that recently became the first school in our urban area to go 1:1 iPads in grades PreK-5. This is ideal--I"m out of the classroom, but still get to be around kids all day. If the situation was overseas was ideal, I'd teach again, but I much prefer a tech coordinator, CIO, EdTech Coach, or other non-classroom position. I'm also a dual US/EU citizen if it makes any difference.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts.

Why so many of you insist on arguing and going back and forth with people you claim to detest never fails to amuse me.

The original question, to me, was getting at the increasingly long lead time that schools are asking for. To me, it is unreasonable to make a person decide what they'll be doing the next school year in October. In that case, I'd have no issue telling them that I'll stay and then telling them once I got a job that I changed my mind. I'm not a slave and have agency.

I'd let the hiring school know that I'll be telling my current school immediately so that they wouldn't be surprised if a call did come trying to ruin the job for me. Where it gets hard is recommendations. I usually try to keep a relationship with an AP or other admin who is willing to help out a good teacher with a rec and doesn't care that I didn't pledge myself to 2 more years just a month after the year begins. In my experience it hasn't been too hard.

While I understand not burning bridges unless you need to, I don't understand the mentality that says 'never cross admin because that is bad.' There is no dignity or strength into letting people walk over you.

I am currently working back in the US, in a right to work state. Here, schools relish that they can fire anyone at anytime for any reason, yet still act surprised and hurt when a teacher uses the same privilege.

But, nothing is black and white. Hopefully everyone was given the critical thinking skills to make the best decision for themselves without caring overly much what someone who doesn't care about them thinks. By the way, except for one post that I wouldn't go back to if I were starving, every workplace has offered to let me come back and maintained some form of contact. So I must be doing something right. You should never bargain from a position of weakness unless you want to lose. Forcing yourself into a decision 10 months ahead of time is screwing yourself for no reason and no gain.

Yet another, 'I'm out of here and never coming back post." Check out the videos on YouTube mocking this exact phenomena. If you're going to leave, do it, no need to spread drama on the way out the door.

Your information about dual citizenship is wrong. The US does not have any issue with dual citizenship. I have citizenship in Ireland and the US, and i have many friends with dual citizenship. My children have citizenship (and passports) from 3 countries, none of which has an issue with them holding multiple citizenships. This will be increasingly common as barriers to travel continue to decrease while information about formerly exotic destinations becomes commonplace.

A quick trip Google would have given you the citizenship information directly from the State Department and multiple other sources. The law has not changed in the 20+ years since I acquired my second citizenship.

I'll address a few points.

The city where I lived in the Philippines is right next to the old Clark air base. There are many expats who have been long term residents, and who have some degree of collective and individual clout. I lived in the city and have friends who lived in the city even longer, before I started teaching there. The only real connections that I had from this group was access to attorneys who did business with friends and who could be trusted. Those attorneys then jockey for power with everyone else. In the end, money is pretty much the determiner of justice in an extraordinary number of cases.

The connection that I lucked upon was the cousin of a former student's mother. The family was there from the beginning of the school, and had been mistreated by the school. I had a good relationship with her kid, so she liked me. She also became semi-friends with my wife. Because this woman knew what the school was capable of, and believed me, and had connections inside of the school that confirmed me, she was willing to ask for a favor. The favor was done in extreme secrecy and also involved some luck in how the case was assigned. I'm extremely fortunate and grateful that those people were willing to help.

They would never consider publicly backing what I just said and would disavow even knowing me if asked directly about it. I can't imagine a scenario where what they could lose was even close to weighing the same as the negligible benefits of backing my story.

The immigration help came from an attorney working with my connection. He had friends in the immigration office and had worked there earlier in his career. The NBI actually believed that I was out of compliance, and that Immigration would deport me. Once immigration looked me up, they saw that I was a permanent resident in good standing and that my U.S. passport had not expired. They knew this since they put a yearly visa stamp in my passport. The only (but appreciated) help that I got in immigration is that a friend of my connection took over the case. He seemed to be a younger middle manager type, but no one else really wanted to deal with it, so he was senior. He kept me in different room from the NBI and wouldn't let them take me back, like they wanted to do once they realized that they were wrong. When he did give me back to them, it was with a reminder that I was a friend of his and that he wanted them to take good care of me.

While I was at immigration, I also gave them information about the owners, who travel in and out of the country illegally because of their own connections. My dates matched exactly with their records, so they also looked at me as a possible way to make money of their own. They knew that I was only in it for payback.

Bottom line is that my connections weren't that powerful. They were powerful enough to keep the NBI from pursuing it with much zeal. They knew that they were on shaky ground and it was something that could blow up into something that they didn't want/wasn't worth to them.

After that, the connections to get papers signed were from filipino friends. Guards at the house were because we paid them, and the barangay captain was sympathetic to my Filipino family's plight.

Now as to how I know what I know:

That my labor case was bribed away by the school I know because my lawyer in the case was told by one of his connections with the Department of Labor. I can't prove it on an internet forum.

That the teacher was up to no good I know because I felt that the guy was a creep from the time that I first met him. That part of the Philippines has no shortage of international pervs. One day on my way out of the school, I saw the silhouettes of an adult and a small child inside of his darkened classroom. They were behind his desk, him sitting, her standing next to him. There was a cartoon video playing on the digital projector.

Even if nothing was going on, it was creepy. I went to the headmaster and he raced up there. Later he told me that there was other disturbing information that had already come up. The head went to the room, asked the little girl to leave, and then told the teacher that he was fired. The teacher begged for another chance and admitted that he had let things get out of control. The head stayed firm and sent him packing.

The head announced to the whole school that the teacher should not be talked about any longer. I pushed the head to take some action. The head agreed that something should be done, but wanted permission from the board first. The board told the head that it was enough that they guy was fired and that they wanted that to be the end of it. The head relayed to me that the Chairman of the board told him that it would scare away current and potential students and was not worth the problems since the guy was gone.

The girl that I saw the teacher in the room with was 8 years old. She told a female teacher that she had made plans to visit the teacher at his apartment to watch videos, but that she hadn't gone yet. Other notes and rumors brought up the story of the 15 year old student and the teacher. They had some pretty risque banter going on in Facebook. The girl agreed to talk with an older sister because she wasn't comfortable talking with the admin or a teacher directly. The sister told the headmaster that the girl had been over to the teacher's apartment several times and had sex with him. She told her that she had - sex even though she didn't want to.

You won't find any court documents about any of this because it never made it to court. The girl didn't want to go public and risk the shame and humiliation. The sister didn't think that it would help to tell the parents. The school didn't want to tell the parents or the police.

You may consider all of this just rumor, but I would sure be interested to know about this kind of things before I started working at a school.

I had an active case against the school in labor court. I had gone to the police to see if they would pursue the case. The police wouldn't even look into it unless the girl was willing to file charges. After I left the school, I created a website that detailed the truth about the school for potential teachers and parents. The school was beyond enraged that several teachers left reviews on ISR. If you've been around cut throat Korean businessmen, it is all about reputation and face, not so much about ethics.

The school had treated us badly, lied, deceived and cheated everyone--staff, teachers, students, and parents. Once I knew that I was leaving and had a job secured, I let loose on them with the website, which was actually a better url for the school than the one that they used. The Koreans were so aloof that they didn't have much in the way of connections, except for people that charged them way too much money for bribes and grease money.

I'm not using this forum to defame the school. I related my story as to how badly things could go wrong. I don't really see the need to provide emails that would just drag people into the story who don't really want anything to do with it anymore. I do like recounting the story myself because eventually, all of the details of the three years I spent at the school will make a great story.

If you knew anything about SE Asia, and one of the most corrupt cities within that zone, you'd know that this story isn't even that far out there. Believe it as you will or don't, it doesn't change anything.

I have a paper memo that the head sent out that says "I wish to inform you that ****** has left *** with immediate effect. I would be grateful if this news remains within *** and is not discussed outside our campus. We are looking for an ESL teacher to join our ESL team." Anyone could have typed it, so it isn't much for proof.

There is a website called expat exchange that has references to what happened. You have to look up schools in the Philippines. I could list a slew of witnesses to the whole thing, but what would I gain from doing so? It could only cause grief for anyone commenting.

I have memos that show that I was acting principal after the first two principals left during the first few months of the school. I have memos that show I was the head of high school after we hired a regular head. I have emails from the head who conspired with the Koreans whining about how his 'girlfriend' is having sex with other guys for money--all from the school email address.

You'd have a hard time finding someone who had lived in the Philippines long term as an expat who wouldn't recognize truth in the story that I just told. That it seems beyond belief, or made-up is only because you haven't lived as a local in a third world country. The behavior of the Koreans is also pretty within the realm of normal for Korean for profit school owners in third world countries.

So, fancy flight of fiction or cautionary tale, is pretty much up to you to decide.

Before you decide where you want to live more long-term, you should check out the property laws carefully. Some countries won't let foreigners buy property. Others will let you do it, but off little in protection if someone else decides that they want it, etc.

nikkor, inman, and Open C,

It's all true, all of it is documented in emails and memos from them. The case is still open in city court. Supposedly, it will be dismissed at the next hearing, which could be anytime in the next few years. It was a surreal school in a fairly surreal location. I crammed about a decade of experiences into 4 years. The NBI confiscated my computer and backup hard drive, so I lost a ton of photos, documents, and notes. Some things survived in the cloud though.

There is a lot more to the story. By the third year, it was time to move on. The board/owners were aggressively attacking our salary and benefits and completely ignoring our contracts. After I left, I filed a complaint with the labor department. I believe that I was winning the case, when 'someone' stepped in from the national labor department and told the regional DOL to rule for the school.

Everything that I know about the bribes paid and amounts is from connections that I had in the agencies involved. Nothing is a secret in the Philippines. The corruption is bold and in your face. If you know the right people, most other people won't mess with you. Once I was in jail, the NBI were also bragging about the whole thing. They knew no one would believe me over them on anything that they said, so they would taunt me with it. A couple of people pretty far up in the legal/justice system confirmed that what happened wouldn't have happened for any less than 25K. The regional director of the NBI was at my gate over a libel charge, which is about the lowest level of complaint that the NBI would handle.

nikkor, you are right, they could have paid someone less than $100 to just kill me. Life is pretty cheap in the Philippines. The whole thing would have been a total disaster if I hadn't made a point of making as many connections as I could when I started living there. Without the cover, protection, and favors of several people, things would have been much worse.

After I got released we had 2 armed local police guards at the front of our house 24/7. More great stories there.

Doing it silently or confidentially wasn't an option at that point. A couple of friends were vocal about what happened at the school. Some others were privately supportive, but wouldn't say so publicly. A lot of others turned their back completely. The responses correlated pretty well with their ability to get a job anywhere else. Situations that intense usually tell you who your real friends are.

While I hope that I'd do the same thing regardless of my own situation, any bravery is dulled by the fact that I had already decided not to return, had a job waiting in the U.S. and was ready to quit before the end of the year before this really started. I had already quit by a couple of weeks when the NBI got involved. I don't know what I would have done if I intended or needed to stay in that job.

My worst experience was in the Philippines. The school hired mostly certified staff for the core subjects, but took any riff raff cruising the sex scene for ESL teachers. One of the ESL teachers was having sex with a 15 year old student. The school wouldn't do anything, including telling the parents, because it would have hurt their bottom line.

Ironically, they were also worried about their bottom line when they didn't check background, references, or use common sense in hiring the slime ball.

The school was spiraling out of control because of overbearing, incompetent owners, and an incompetent scammer Brit as the head. I went to the authorities about the rape. Within a week, the NBI (FBI equivalent in Philippines) was at my gate with 10 agents, including the regional head--all for a warrant for libel. They took all the computer equipment in the house, all of my documents, 'found' drugs (a common NBI tactic) and carted me off to jail.

I'm a permanent resident of the Philippines, and had lived there over 4 years by that time. Merely by not being a condescending asshole and kind, I had developed a lot of friendships in that time. We found out that the school paid 25K U.S. for the raid and jailing. Luckily, I had connections of my own, and I was released in about 5 days.

This infuriated the NBI (I was an asshole to them the whole time, because I refused to bow down before the paid thugs who raided my home in front of my children). To get back at me, they tried to get me put in immigration jail. They found an expired U.S. passport at my house. I also had a current U.S. passport, a current Irish passport, and a Philippine permanent resident visa. But, they thought that they knew everything and assumed that I overstayed my visa. I didn't, because I can live there as long as I want, but the fools gave it a try anyway.

They took me to Manila in handcuffs to the main immigration building. By that time, my contacts, who had connections at Immigration, had made calls in advance of my arrival.

The NBI thugs got a surprise when immigration went after them for bringing a bullshit case to them. Finally, I was released after 5 days. I had connections get the paperwork that I needed for leaving the country, because the NBI had stolen all of my id, except for US. passport, which was hidden. Got out of the country and had my family in the U.S. about a year later.

That was almost exactly 2 years ago. The case is still not over. I'm being tried in abstentia, but it is about to be dismissed because there are no witnesses and no more money to keep the NBI interested.

I wrote about this before and it was moderated on the ISR blog, I don't know why. I won't list the school name this time, and maybe it will stay. You won't have to search message boards too hard before you discover the school.

In hindsight, it was a pretty cool adventure. At the time, I thought that I was dead. We had a 6x8 cell for 6 of us. They gave me the bed (a raised bamboo platform) because they felt sorry for me. The other prisoners were incredibly kind. After I got out, I visited all of their families with messages and big bags of rice because I owed them so much for being so good to me.

Good times, good times.

Personally, I'd wait to go to a better school. The pay is low and you won't have that much extra travel money unless you use savings. The philippines, probably like most 3rd world countries isn't much fun past vacation time if you don't have enough money to live a better lifestyle.

I returned 2 years ago from spending 4 years in the Philippines. A coworker went to CIS and didn't have much good to say about it--and this was a guy without much in the way of options.

If your goal is 2 months of traveling, you'd be better off making your current good salary and spending 2 months in SE Asia. No need to make minimum wage for 10 months just to travel for 2.

On another forum, someone commented that DODEA charges very high tuition for children of teachers, unless spouse is military. Is this accurate?

My feeling is that a school that is strong shouldn't need to address this stuff unless parents go to admin and ask. If the first school is doing everything right, then people wouldn't consider jumping ship.

If I was happy with everything about the school my kids were attending, including value, I wouldn't pay any attention. If I wasn't thrilled about my school, I'd listen to the new school.

From my experiences and those that friends have conveyed, this happens all of the time in Asia.

thanks for the reply.

What about in non-international schools? Any opportunities there? I remember for example someone writing that the local schools in Switzerland paid much more than an international school paid foreigners. Not necessarily interested in Switzerland, just an example.

If i'm reading wannateach right, they are saying that you can't even apply until August, not that you'd have your certificate by then.

In most states, its a completely lame and unacceptable situation.