[quote="shansar"]Johnwest was that the Bangkok Fair you just got back from?
How did that go? From what I have heard there were a lot of positions that went unfilled and more jobs open than teachers.
Good to hear your input. I know for a fact the ISS Fairs are NOT cheap adding to the pressure if you don't find that position.[/quote]
It's my understanding the ISS and Search Bangkok are at the same time. Can anyone compare? I'm assuming Search is cheaper- plus their 'standards' or the process to get in are more lenient. Why would someone got to ISS when most schools attend both?
Best teacher placement agency/job fair
Bangkok
Don't know where your info. came from on Bangkok, but know a lot of information to the contrary. Personally know at least 8 experienced, currently employed teachers in international schools, who went away without jobs, and several couples who took jobs they didn't want because of one of several possibilities. a) the jobs which were posted, many which remain posted, at ISS were not available at the fair, nor are they available now b) many schools had hired a share of their positions via personal contacts or Skype prior to fair c) many schools felt no pressure to hire as they were bound to attend several other fairs anyway d) teachers without extensive IB experience could not get an interview at many schools (some administrators, of course, are wise enough to not exclude good people because of this) e) people tended to get frantic and felt like they should walk away with a firm offer after spending thousands of dollars to attend the fair, and in this economy were unwilling to wait. Know several couples who were contemplating places they never thought they'd consider simply because there wasn't anything else and they had family to support, left them making hard decisions. Others turned things down because it wasn't a good fit for them or their family for one reason or another, and now are wondering where to go and what to do.
The atmosphere was VERY different this year than in previous years, people seemed more tense. Ran into a couple in an elevator after they had signed contracts and we were obviously the first people they had seen after doing so. When they told us out loud where they were going, the first time they had spoken the words outside of the room where they had signed, the woman had to be helped to a chair - almost fainted! In short, it was NOT a "teachers' fair" - in spite of what administrators will claim.
What difference does it make to you as a candidate if there are openings for 800 positions and only 350 candidates, but there are only 5-6 openings in your field, and dozens of candidates in your field, and schools won't interview you because of IB or because you're married to the wrong combination?
Of course there were happy faces as well, and perhaps those people who were "wooed" assiduously feel far differently than this - but sure met lots of people, even people who went away with positions, who were not happy with this fair.
Know from experience this process looks far, far more enthralling when you are teaching stateside, long for change, and can attend a fair and flirt with possibility all the while knowing you have a tenured job that you can return to should the perfect job not come up, since you don't have to sign next year's contract until late spring. It's a bit more dire when the contracts had to be back by late November and you're out there without a safety net.
The atmosphere was VERY different this year than in previous years, people seemed more tense. Ran into a couple in an elevator after they had signed contracts and we were obviously the first people they had seen after doing so. When they told us out loud where they were going, the first time they had spoken the words outside of the room where they had signed, the woman had to be helped to a chair - almost fainted! In short, it was NOT a "teachers' fair" - in spite of what administrators will claim.
What difference does it make to you as a candidate if there are openings for 800 positions and only 350 candidates, but there are only 5-6 openings in your field, and dozens of candidates in your field, and schools won't interview you because of IB or because you're married to the wrong combination?
Of course there were happy faces as well, and perhaps those people who were "wooed" assiduously feel far differently than this - but sure met lots of people, even people who went away with positions, who were not happy with this fair.
Know from experience this process looks far, far more enthralling when you are teaching stateside, long for change, and can attend a fair and flirt with possibility all the while knowing you have a tenured job that you can return to should the perfect job not come up, since you don't have to sign next year's contract until late spring. It's a bit more dire when the contracts had to be back by late November and you're out there without a safety net.
ISS Bangkok
Yes, it was ISS Bangkok that I attended. My impression was that there were a lot of openings but that recruiters were targeting almost exclusively teaching couples. I interviewed with several schools that dropped notes into my folder saying that they were strongly pursuing couples or had hired couples, one partner of whom took the job for which I had been interviewed. I ran into many single teachers who were not offered anything. They-including myself-were very stressed. I felt that this should have been labeled a couples-only fair.
Not being familiar enough with that part of Bangkok, I sucked it up and paid to stay at the host hotel. It was a very nice, albeit expensive, vacation.
I still contend that the information received from UNI and Search is much more informative, more thorough. ISS has symbols such as "1" on some of their categories but no key to know what this means. I should not have to ask them what it means. None of the directors with whom I had interviewed had actually read my file. I thought that was why they arrived a day or two early, but I guess I am mistaken. Or perhaps they are convinced that any candidate invited to that particular event is a worthy individual. For my own ego, I go with the latter!
BTW, I actually did end up signing at ISS for just the type of position for which I had been looking. It was a last-minute interview with a director who was headed for the airport right after the interview!
Not being familiar enough with that part of Bangkok, I sucked it up and paid to stay at the host hotel. It was a very nice, albeit expensive, vacation.
I still contend that the information received from UNI and Search is much more informative, more thorough. ISS has symbols such as "1" on some of their categories but no key to know what this means. I should not have to ask them what it means. None of the directors with whom I had interviewed had actually read my file. I thought that was why they arrived a day or two early, but I guess I am mistaken. Or perhaps they are convinced that any candidate invited to that particular event is a worthy individual. For my own ego, I go with the latter!
BTW, I actually did end up signing at ISS for just the type of position for which I had been looking. It was a last-minute interview with a director who was headed for the airport right after the interview!
ISS Bangkok
Hey, Scribe! Looks like we cross-posted. Yes, I agree with what you said about the stress at ISS Bangkok. It was not a fun fair (until I landed my position at the last minute).
Re: ISS Bangkok
[quote="johnwest"]Not being familiar enough with that part of Bangkok, I sucked it up and paid to stay at the host hotel. It was a very nice, albeit expensive, vacation. [/quote]
Were you coming from the States? I'm considering going next year from Chicago as many Asian schools attend the Search fair there. Don't want to wait until UNI or the Stateside fairs.
Were you coming from the States? I'm considering going next year from Chicago as many Asian schools attend the Search fair there. Don't want to wait until UNI or the Stateside fairs.
ISS, etc.
Of course it's to make money. They are businesses, other than UNI. That's probably another reason I like them so much!
Yes, JISAlum, I flew from the States to Bangkok (end of winter break), then on to my current post in Africa. Kansas City to Paris to Bangkok. Long time in airplanes!
Yes, JISAlum, I flew from the States to Bangkok (end of winter break), then on to my current post in Africa. Kansas City to Paris to Bangkok. Long time in airplanes!
why indeed?
This question of why so early has been kicked around quite a bit, and it just keeps getting earlier. Teachers at our school who had indicated they "might" return rather than a definitive yes or no in October (yes, that's when people were officially asked the first time, earlier requests were made verbally) faced an interesting dilemma. Prior to announcement of what raise would be next year, "maybes" were called on the carpet in November to ask to commit even though the deadline was early December. Reason? School didn't want anyone deciding on basis of money, apparently. Wonder if the board knows how unconcerned the administrators feels educators should be about money when they negotiate their contracts? Let's just assume a double standard exists here.
Aside from that, have had various conversations with administrators about this tendency to recruit earlier and earlier. Some allow teachers to go to that first fair and then the teachers and the administrators communicate during the fair as to whether or not the opening exists and the person is moving on, or whether the teacher is going to "reclaim" the spot. That at least is fairly humane, not to mention practical. It has to be more economical and efficient to go with a proven performer - no new shipping costs, no initial visa cost, only renewal fees. Less hassle with transition - a win/win situation for everyone, except maybe the school head who has a preconceived notion of how things should work. (If teachers were that rigid in the classroom, how depressing it would be.) A few heads moaned and said they wished they had "the luxury" of doing the same. What was preventing them?
There is an atmosphere of competitiveness in recruiting that is counter to what schools foster in principal - a feeling of community, of caring. Why couldn't the heads of major schools simply choose to step back, to slow down the timetable? Do they honesty believe there wouldn't be candidates? Fear seems to be driving lots of this - fear that some other school will get first look at candidates, fear that you might be missing out.
What's the buzz in overseas education right now? It's all about student learning (as if THAT was a surprise). Competitiveness, extended absences during recruiting season, fear, anxiety on teachers' part: how do any of these add up to improved student learning? And now, rather than have this undesireable situation exist from say Feb. on, it starts in October - when students still have 7 months in the classroom.
Aside from that, have had various conversations with administrators about this tendency to recruit earlier and earlier. Some allow teachers to go to that first fair and then the teachers and the administrators communicate during the fair as to whether or not the opening exists and the person is moving on, or whether the teacher is going to "reclaim" the spot. That at least is fairly humane, not to mention practical. It has to be more economical and efficient to go with a proven performer - no new shipping costs, no initial visa cost, only renewal fees. Less hassle with transition - a win/win situation for everyone, except maybe the school head who has a preconceived notion of how things should work. (If teachers were that rigid in the classroom, how depressing it would be.) A few heads moaned and said they wished they had "the luxury" of doing the same. What was preventing them?
There is an atmosphere of competitiveness in recruiting that is counter to what schools foster in principal - a feeling of community, of caring. Why couldn't the heads of major schools simply choose to step back, to slow down the timetable? Do they honesty believe there wouldn't be candidates? Fear seems to be driving lots of this - fear that some other school will get first look at candidates, fear that you might be missing out.
What's the buzz in overseas education right now? It's all about student learning (as if THAT was a surprise). Competitiveness, extended absences during recruiting season, fear, anxiety on teachers' part: how do any of these add up to improved student learning? And now, rather than have this undesireable situation exist from say Feb. on, it starts in October - when students still have 7 months in the classroom.
recruitment fairs
Thanks for all the fantastic comments! I, too, am concerned with the ever-extending "open-season" for teachers. I was asked in October if I was returning the following August. The first ads for '09-'10 that I noticed were published in March, 2008.
I am also concerned with the focus on married couples. Despite the claim by some schools to be looking for the highest-qualified teachers regardless of marital status, I have received the notes telling me they were still pursuing couples, but that I was also still being considered--if they did not get the couples for whom they were in contention. I do realize that the housing benefit is an enormous expense for most schools, but...
DISCLAIMER: I am not trying to diss any of my couples friends! I have spoken to several who feel that being married is not the advantage we are led to believe. It's just that I hear otherwise from the schools!
I am also concerned with the focus on married couples. Despite the claim by some schools to be looking for the highest-qualified teachers regardless of marital status, I have received the notes telling me they were still pursuing couples, but that I was also still being considered--if they did not get the couples for whom they were in contention. I do realize that the housing benefit is an enormous expense for most schools, but...
DISCLAIMER: I am not trying to diss any of my couples friends! I have spoken to several who feel that being married is not the advantage we are led to believe. It's just that I hear otherwise from the schools!
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TopTeacher
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 5:47 pm
Well I attended the recent ISS Bangkok and did hear from many, many people that it was a rough fair/year all around. It was my first recruitment experience (though I'm already teaching at an international school) so I didn't have anything to compare it to.
Super-huge schools barely had openings. So many things filled up already by the sign-up dash. I was lucky in that I got interviews with everyone I wanted--minus Singapore American School, which stopped people in line to say they wanted couples only--and 3 offers ahead of the fair, one of which I ended up accepting the very first day I was there. In fact, I think I succumbed to the tension and pressure early by canceling all my second interviews, making up my mind by the first afternoon, though I'm very happy with my decision and think I lucked out. I shudder to think of how differently it might have turned out had I not done my homework and Skyped with those 3 schools ahead of time. Anyway, should I head out again, I will most definitely think hard about accepting an offer without the bother of a fair.
Super-huge schools barely had openings. So many things filled up already by the sign-up dash. I was lucky in that I got interviews with everyone I wanted--minus Singapore American School, which stopped people in line to say they wanted couples only--and 3 offers ahead of the fair, one of which I ended up accepting the very first day I was there. In fact, I think I succumbed to the tension and pressure early by canceling all my second interviews, making up my mind by the first afternoon, though I'm very happy with my decision and think I lucked out. I shudder to think of how differently it might have turned out had I not done my homework and Skyped with those 3 schools ahead of time. Anyway, should I head out again, I will most definitely think hard about accepting an offer without the bother of a fair.